The Shrine

Did you READ your own article??

Atheists or agnostics account for 4 percent of the total population.

That is NOT "kicking ass and taking names". The article describes how there seems to be a trend of people moving away from the traditional religions and more of that percent listing as having "no religion" and nothing in particular.

Just because someone says they don't belong to a religion does NOT mean they are atheists or agnostics. I don't belong to a religion but I sure as hell am not atheist or agnostic.

Odd. I was just trying to find to an article based on a NBC News story that I was watching. I could have swore that they said that the "non-affiliates" was at 17 percent, and it was the fastest growing population among the survey.

Oh, and if you don't believe in anything, then yes, you would be an agnostic.

TFA wrote:The majority of the unaffiliated — 12 percent of the overall population — describe their religion as "nothing in particular," and about half of those say faith is at least somewhat important to them.

Okay, this statement is kind of a contradiction. If you don't have a religion, then how can you believe in anything or have faith in anything? If you believe in the bible, then that makes you a Christian, even if you don't go to church.

And how did we get from 12 percent to 17 percent in the same survey? "One in four adults ages 18 to 29 claim no affiliation with a religious institution." Oh, I guess it was based on age division. Anyway...

Wow Sine... your post is so full of ignorance I don't know where to start.

First, learn what Agnosticism is. It's not the lack of a belief-- it's the belief that there is no way to know if there really is an invisible sky wizard so they remain skeptical about it yet are still open to the possibility. More like a "I don't believe your sun god exists until I can see some sort of proof he does"

Second, you can have beliefs without them being tied to a religion. I hate and am against organized religion, but I still have my own set of beliefs. Doesn't make me agnostic, or nihilistic, or any other buzz word-- just means that I can have beliefs without tying to a pre-existing religion. So yes, people can have faith without belonging to a religious organization.

Never figured you to be THAT closed minded man...

Fine. An agnostic theist. It still qualifies as agnosticism. My point was that organized religion is slowly breaking apart, and people are thinking for themselves, instead of blindly following their parent's religion.

As much as I'd love to believe that... it's not happening. This has happened a few times throughout history, it's almost like a supply and demand sort of thing. We'll see some more people turn away from organized religion, but they'll never go away and you cna be sure we'll see an upturn in another few decades.

I've known people with no official religious affiliations, and are decidedly not agnostic or atheist. They believe in something, they just don't follow any organized religion. I think that probably accounts for a lot of that 17%.

EDIT: "Agnostic theist" is an oxymoron. You're either one or the other; you can't be both. Someone who is not part of organized religion does not automatically fall under agnosticism.

Simply put:

Theism is the belief that God(s) exists and rejects the belief that one does not exist

Atheism is the belief that God(s) do(es) not exist and rejects that one does exist.

Agnosticism is the stance to reject belief of God(s) and also reject the belief that one doesn't exist. It is simply a rejection of both of the other stances due to lack of knowledge.


People who believe in spiritualism, but believe that a God or Gods do not exist are still atheists.

It is not so simplistic though, as the definition of God branches out... For example, some might believe God to simply be the origin of life and energy on Earth but has no consciousness and no interest in the destinies of those who live on the Earth; others might believe that Gods require human qualities, and therefore would label those who believe the first example as atheists.

Agnostic Theism. What? You think I just pulled that phrase out of my ass?

Agnostic theism is the philosophical view that encompasses both theism and agnosticism. An agnostic theist is one who views that the truth value of certain claims, in particular the existence of god(s) is unknown or inherently unknowable but chooses to believe in God(s) in spite of this.

Theism is the belief that gods or deities exist, while agnosticism is the belief that the existence of gods are unknown or inherently unknowable. Belief is defined as a conviction of the truth of a proposition without necessarily any proof. Agnosticism does not violate this, and this definition of theism does not violate agnosticism, implying that it is possible to be both theist and agnostic.