The Shrine

<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>Still no weapons of mass destruction found nor any evidence at all that Iraq was preparing any sort of attack against the US or any of its neighboring countries, let alone having any abilitiey to do so.

How will history judge this whole situation?

As a brutal occupation of a sovereign nation, trying to enforce a very unwanted western system of government on a people who seem to despise it. The reason why people disliked Sadam in the first place was because they felt he was an infedel. It is amazing though, the world is actually now a more dangerous place with Saddam gone. Terrorism seems to only have increased.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Well Bush is a goddamn moron and the war never should have happened... but don't gloat too much, there are people dying every day over there.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt "EngraversGothic BT", "Copperplate Gothic Light", "Century Gothic"; text-align: left; '>I notice that the media isn't covering Iraqi 24-7 any more, so the masses won't care. Ignorance is power. Power is media. Media is history. Therefore, history is ignorance.</div>

<div style='font: 9pt Arial; text-align: left; '>The way the networks were over-covering the blackouts last week (especially ABC etc) it reminded me of Iraq for a brief moment (although by the next day it was over).</div>

<div style='font: italic bold 14pt ; text-align: center; '>No, they were overcovering NYC. They ignored everywhere else</div>

<div style='font: 11pt "Fine Hand"; text-align: left; '>Should have kept Saddam in power. He was a nice merciful guy. Just ask him nicely to step down, he would have. Really. No....REALLY!</div>

<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>Keeping Saddam in power would have been the best choice of action for the Iraqi people. The war was criminal, there was absolutely no reason and no use for it. The embargo's should have also been lifted so Iraq could function again.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt "Fine Hand"; text-align: left; '>Oh yes. Even before 1991, Saddam was a saint. You should have visited and not come back.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>What the hell are you talking about?</div>

<div style='font: 11pt "Fine Hand"; text-align: left; '>That you should have met Saddam, that's all. Too bad you missed out on a great opportunity.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt Dominion; text-align: left; '>people living in fear is always a good thing</div>

<div style='font: 10pt ; text-align: left; '>Have you guys seen the movie "Bob Roberts" starring Tim Robbins? It's a classic flick, and a refreshing couple of hours. Its about a singer, businessman, politician, who's running for a senate posistion. Its full of political satire. And it is kickass.

I really wouldn't mind all the US imperialism if our government would just be honest about what the hell its doing in every corner of the world. If you plan on 100 years of global domination just tell us about it and let us go back to our cigarettes and beer.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt "EngraversGothic BT", "Copperplate Gothic Light", "Century Gothic"; text-align: left; '>I would be perfectly happy with Arizona Bay and Pennsylvania Beach.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt "EngraversGothic BT", "Copperplate Gothic Light", "Century Gothic"; text-align: left; '>Rumsfeld didn't seem to have a problem with it.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt "EngraversGothic BT", "Copperplate Gothic Light", "Century Gothic"; text-align: left; '>Like right now?</div>

<div style='font: 9pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Yeah true. They did the same with the 9/11 bombings too (some people who missed the original reports had no clue that D.C. was hit, I jest you not).</div>

<div style='font: 11pt "Fine Hand"; text-align: left; '>Of course not. He has the US military to back him up.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt "Fine Hand"; text-align: left; '>From the Saddam loyalists and looters.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt "EngraversGothic BT", "Copperplate Gothic Light", "Century Gothic"; text-align: left; '>At least with Saddam in power, everybody had a common enemy. Now, everybody fears for themselves, and they don't even have electricity or water now, and little food.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt "EngraversGothic BT", "Copperplate Gothic Light", "Century Gothic"; text-align: left; '>I was referring to Rumsfeld shaking hands with Saddam. Why do we have this same boring fucking conversation over and over again? At least if you're going to start an argument, start it where we left off or something.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt "Fine Hand"; text-align: left; '>Germany and Japan was out of power for a lot longer. Look at them. Democracy is a good thing, ya know. Then again, you prefer the Marxist ways.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt "Fine Hand"; text-align: left; '>Oh, you mean Seeker defending Saddam?</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>CNN had the balls to interview Iraqis about the NY blackout. The general respose was "Welcome to our world - except we're stuck here, you're just visiting."</div>

<div style='font: 11pt ; text-align: left; '>Hey who knows, maybe in the long run this'll work out for Iraq. And I mean like the 100 year long run.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>Since when has the social sittuation in Germany and Japan ever been like Iraq? Democracy does not work in all nations, look at South and Central America, and even Iraq.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>Iraq was not alone in the war against the Persians, the US government gave Iraq the means and the confidence to strike at their enemies. Weaponry and money was sent, and it was sent afterwards as well. The war on Kuwait, Iraq had been in negotiations for 13 years about Kuwait drilling Iraqi oil fields. Bush's Ambassador approached Saddam and told him it would be fine to invade Kuwait. It was Iran on a much smaller scale. Then the US government stepped in and pushed the UN for war against Iraq, war was declared, and over a hundred thousand were killed instantly. They then sponsored and enforced sanctions which included embargos which cut off the income of drugs, pesticides, herbicides, and fungicides, luxuries, and school supplies, which Iraq previously had plenty of, more than any other Arab nation. 50,000 kilograms of depleted Uranium was left behind in Iraq which caused cancer rates in the country to increase nearly tenfold, and other health problems six times greater in occurance (these were both cited many times in Saddam's letters to the UN urging for a lift of the sanctions). In the end millions had died, and now that war has occured living conditions have even further declined, and criminal activity is now so bad that everyone in the country has to own a gun. Also on top of the dramatic rise in criminal activity, and fall in the overall quality of life, terrorist activity has increased since the invasion and occupation, since the posting of my first post, the UN headquarters in Iraq has been destroyed.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>There's been conflict in Iraq for about 7,000 years. Saddams revolutionary republic was actually one of the more peaceful regimes =P</div>

<div style='font: 10pt "EngraversGothic BT", "Copperplate Gothic Light", "Century Gothic"; text-align: left; '>Democracy and Marxist ways (ie: socialism) can co-exist. The former is a form of goverment, and the latter is a form of economics.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt "EngraversGothic BT", "Copperplate Gothic Light", "Century Gothic"; text-align: left; '>"Here's the plane hitting the first tower. Back, and to the right. Back, and to the right. Back, and to the right. Back, and to the right. Back, and to the right. Back, and to the right. Back, and to the right..."</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>Bullshit. His regime committed genocide on the Kurds in Iraq.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>For the record, I agree with most of your criticisms of the US's actions and policies. However, I think you are more interested in critcizing the US than anything else; I didn't want the war to happen, but I'm happy that Hussein is no longer in power.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt Dominion; text-align: left; '>democracy isn't working in those parts of the world because cartels and such with extensive ties and firepower won't let it</div>

<div style='font: 11pt Dominion; text-align: left; '>right, because everything Saddam did in the 80's and 90's wasn't really genocide...it was just 'ethnic cleansing'</div>

<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>You're thinking of Milosovech, and he only attempted it.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>Is that what your news networks told you? There are still plenty of Kurds spread out between Turky and Iraq, and the Turks have killed far more than the Iraqi's.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>"Genocide" is not limited to the complete extermination of a people. The person who created the word, Raphael Lemkin, specificaly avoided that definition because then the word would only apply when it was too late.

Hussein's government systematicly gassed towns to solve their "Kurdish problem." Over the years, deaths were in the order of magnitude of 100,000. I'm sure the Turks have slaughtered lots of Kurds too, but not on that magnitude. If you know of anything anywhere saying otherwise, I'd like to read it. (Although the Turks did commit genocide against the Amernians during WWI.)</div>

<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>No matter how you look at it, genocide is still the planned extermination of an entire national or ethnic group, that is its definition. It matters not what you read in that book, as I highly doubt any of it is very true at all, especially since it said that 100,000 died when it is well known that it was under 5,000. Also the reason why no blame has been laid on the Turks for killing 30,000 over the past 10 years is because they are allied with the USA. Instead, the Kurds in Turkey are labeled as terrorists, as they previously were labeled in Iraq. Does your book mention anything about South Eastern Turkey? Keep in mind that it is not only the Kurds in South East Turkey who are allied with the Al-Qaeda.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt "Fine Hand"; text-align: left; '>You got your fact skewed again, Saddam-boy. Iraq asked a US official who was not qualified to "okay" an invasion. The war material supplied by the US was for Iraq to use against Ayatollah's Iran in the 80's. Depleted uranium does not cause cancer.</div>