The Shrine

PostPosted:**Mon Nov 17, 2008 2:56 pm**

So apparently Microsoft is creating another "simple" programming language aimed at beginner programmers and children. I'm no professional when it comes to coding, but I remember using QBasic back in the early 90s to learn how to program (it was free and available on pretty much any Windows 3.1 system).

That being said, my understanding is that any BASIC language is garbage for learning to become a sound programmer. I've always been told it lets you do things that violate sound programming logic for the sake of rapid development.

Here is the Ars Technica article: Yet another programming language from Microsoft: Small Basic

PostPosted:**Mon Nov 17, 2008 3:21 pm**

I can see it being useful getting someone interested in the idea of programming without the overwhelming feeling that would come from learning some languages. Though, to me, if you want to learn programming and want something simple and quick, just use VB. I don't see a need for something simpler than that.

I remember playing with QBASIC a long time ago and I know I did things that were not considered good programming, but I don't remember much about it.

PostPosted:**Mon Nov 17, 2008 3:32 pm**

Sounds like a fine idea to me. I think the biggest contribution is the IDE they built specifically for it.

Personally, if I was to teach programming to beginners, I'd use Python. Algorithms in Python read closer to pseudo-code than any other language I have experience with. But then I could still introduce sophisticated concepts through list comprehensions and the functional capabilities like anonymous functions.

PostPosted:**Mon Nov 17, 2008 3:40 pm**

I've used Python some, but it always seemed that I could do the same stuff with Perl. I tend to prefer Perl just because of the vast number of people that use it (plenty of example code; I'd rather take something someone else has done and make it do what I want). I guess Python would be more simple to learn because it is much easier to read. I used to get frustrated learning Perl back in college because everything seems to be coded in "short hand." Doesn't Python also force you to use logical formatting? Isn't white space pertinent?

PostPosted:**Mon Nov 17, 2008 4:58 pm**

Strictly speaking, "white space" is not pertinent, but indentation is. I actually like this, though, since it frees up lines which, in a braced language, contain nothing but a block terminator. I think it adds to the readability.

Anyway, we had a whole thread on this eight months ago: Perl, I'm leaving you

PostPosted:**Thu Nov 20, 2008 8:45 pm**

Bah, line-based languages should have went out of style with BASIC. It's all about how you can format things with the semi-colon.

Also, I do not like shorthand in Perl, either. Sure, you could do something like:

Code: Select all

while (<>) { s/(\W+)/ /g; lc; print; }

But, that barely makes sense. I never, never, never use $_ except for special cases (map commands, sort, "perl -pi -e" statements). Instead:

Code: Select all

# Change non-word characters to space, lowercase, and print
while (my $line = <STDIN>) {
   $line =~ s/(\W+)/ /g; 
   $line = lc($line);
   print $line;
}

See? Much easier to read. You know where you reading, and you know you're editing a line and print it off each time.

Anyway, I've covered the Python/Perl thing in the thread that Kupek linked.