The Shrine

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>So. . .any of you get those free iPods?</div>

<div style='font: 10pt Tahoma; text-align: left; '>Lol, i think it was only Lox who tried, right? Seeing as how there wasnt a follow up post of excitement, i would guess he didnt.</div>

<div style='font: bold 9pt ; text-align: left; '>I'm working on it. My friends are too lazy so I have to rely on people popping up who will do an offer, which isn't very often. And since I refuse to work for it beyond asking people, it's taking me a while to get my offers complete. :)</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '><b>Link:</b> <a href="http://www.homepage.net/pyramidcalculat ... ulator/</a>

Pyramid scheme, pyramid scheme. . .</div>

<div style='font: bold 9pt ; text-align: left; '><b>Link:</b> <a href="http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,64 ... 00.html</a>

It may end up being a scam. If it involved me spending money or asking someone else to do so, then I'd never even bother. But it doesn't, other than them most likely selling your email address to spammers. So sign up for a free email address and then discard it afterwards.

And technically, it doesn't 100% fit into the idea of a pyramid scam because your reward is impacted by your referrals only by them actually fulfilling an offer. Once your referral fulfills an offer, you have no connection to them whatsoever. Pyramid schemes, from what I've seen, generally require your referrals to get referrals to get referrals to benefit. I could care less if my referrals get referrals.

Plus, see my article. Granted, I don't always take Internet news magazine content as gospel but this article does assuage my doubts more than just assuming it's legit.

And back to my main point, it's costing nothing other than me wasting a little bit of time here and there. I'm being optimistic. Life is generally more enjoyable this way, from my experience.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>And I think you're confusing cynicism on my part with basic skepticism. I don't want to take part in their advertising campaign.</div>

<div style='font: bold 9pt ; text-align: left; '>but I don't think it's at that point. I actually need 2 more referrals. I most likely have them both, but since they are people who are not entirely computer-literate, I prefer to show them what to do so that they don't get charged.

I didn't confuse cynicism with skepticism. I interpreted your response as the former. I'm fully aware of the difference. But I'll accept that it's skepticism on your part instead, at least in regards to your opinion on the legitimacy of the deal.

Still, for an Ipod, which I would love to have, joining in on their advertising is not a bad thing to me. (And truth be told, since I'm not exactly going about the process correctly anyhow, they're not really benefitting from my participation beyond my referrals fulfilling an offer and then canceling) :)

I'm not worried that I'll never get my 5 referrals, I'm not assuming that I will. If I do, cool, if not, whatever. But at least I gave it a shot.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt Tahoma; text-align: left; '>I wouldnt categorize this as a pyramid. Lox simply needs 5 referrals, he doesnt need to worry about how many people are above him or anything.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>I'll be shocked if that's how it works out.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>Let me add to that: getting five referrals my qualify him for an iPod, but that alone won't guarantee him one. They need more than five new people involved to offset the $250 cost.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt Tahoma; text-align: left; '>"And while a lot of customers cancel after the free trial, enough don't to make it worthwhile" *shrug*</div>

<div style='font: bold 9pt ; text-align: left; '>5 referrals (along with my completed offer) does gaurantee me an Ipod according to their terms. I wouldn't be involved if I only had the chance and not a gaurantee to get an Ipod if I complete my end of the deal.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '><a href=http://people.bu.edu/jbrock/ipod_analysis.htm>The Free iPod Offer and Why it isn't a Scam</a>
<a href=http://www.uglx.org/scam>Sorry, no free iPods, TVs, or whatevers here</a>
<a href=http://www.uglx.org/scam2>Why are the "freeIpod", "free iPods", "free TVs", "free PCs" schemes scams?</a>

The terms "scam" and "scheme" get thrown around a lot. The first guy uses the word "scam" to mean something that actively cheats you; that is, even if you follow the rules, you won't get it. The other two use the word "scam" to mean something that might work for you, it's just going to be harder than you anticipated and a lot less likely than they advertised.

Just google for "ipod pyramid scheme" for lots more.</div>

<div style='font: bold 9pt ; text-align: left; '>At least I tried to get it. If I become one of the ones who got nothing in return, then so be it. My time spent is a sunk cost anyhow. It shouldn't affect my decision whether to keep trying or not.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>We certainly disagree there; I don't think it's worth my time.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>It's a pyramid scheme in the sense that the further down you get the more difficult it is to get the payoff, but there's no actual entrance fee - the worst outcome is that your time is wasted.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>Heh. Even the most efficient organization of the pyramid makes it so 83% of participants can't possibly reap the benefits.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>I got a free Blockbuster online rental out of it too!</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>Which is significant if you try to get five other people to join. What they're buying here is tens of thousands of people doing their advertising work for them. It sounds free until you consider the amount of time you're putting into the endeavor; your time is worth money.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>Isn't that a little pretentious though? I knew what I was doing, so did Lox, so did most of the people who signed up. You make it sound like we were all duped. It's just that there was nothing to lose. You'd be a bigger sucker by buying a lotto ticket.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>A while ago, someone in my department mentioned making a webpage for some local business. They were probably looking to hire some CS student on the cheap. I remarked to my friends that they probably couldn't afford me or any other fully funded grad student. If I had been approached, I would have said $100 an hour, no less. Are my web development skills worth $100 an hour? Probably not. My free time, however, is, and that's what any job on the side would cut into. With courses and research, my free time was the most valuable thing I had, and unless it was going to bring in enough money for it to make a substantial difference in my savings, I wouldn't consider it.

Right now, I'm inbetween semesters, so I'm not having to work too hard. But I still place a high value on this free time I have. And trying to get other people to join up for this is work. Right now, if I'm going to work, it had better be towards either my thesis, publishing my research, or one of my hobbies.

This isn't a scam, and it's not too good to be true. You're also not getting a free iPod. You're working for it. I'd rather just go out and buy one.

And I'd actually rather buy a lotto ticket than try to get five other people to join up for this thing. A lotto ticket is what, $5? I'd pay $5 so that I don't have to recruit five other people. I pay more than that all the time to enjoy myself. I do it at bars, I do it at movie theaters, I do it at restraunts.

(To stave off people pointing out the irony of the amount of time I've spent discussing this, keep in mind that I enjoy this discussion.)</div>

<div style='font: bold 9pt ; text-align: left; '>that equals out to about 4 minutes a week. A week.

Plus, it's always been done in the middle of other things, like hanging out with friends or family. I've never went and spent x # of hours searching for people. I posted a message or two here. That took all of 10 seconds total.

Heck, I'll stand on my head for 4 minutes a week for a free Ipod instead of choking up $250 for one. Because I'm sure that those 4 minutes a week could not have been devoted to something that would have made me $250 to buy one, unless I'm looking for loose change in couch cusions or something.

Like Gentz said, I'm fully aware of what I am doing. I'm not some schmoe who doesn't understand the concepts of opportunity cost. My opportunity cost in all this is pretty low. To me, it is a free Ipod, because those 4 minutes a week don't bother me in the least. I am also kind of laid back so I don't tend to analyze the value of my free time so maybe that's why. (Don't take that as an insult or anything, I'm just explaining a bit about myself)

If yours isn't, then that's fine. I think you assume & overestimate how much time this really takes. And that's fine too, if that's what you want to base your opinion on.

And yeah, I kinda enjoy this too. :)</div>

<div style='font: 12pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Yeah... "Free iPod" *snicker*.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>Maybe they don't have the free time to waste either! :)

Or maybe the amount of free time that this kinda thing takes up is negligible to most people. I mean, in total, I spent maybe an hour or two on the entire process. And that time woulda just been spent staring at these MBs anyway. It's not like I took time away from writing my symphony or something. If anything, it was <I>more</i> enriching to make the effort to try and get five people to sign up for this than it would have been to sit in front of the TV or mindlessly leaf through these boards which is what I would have been doing - despite the fact that it was little more than an advertising scam (which I was also well-aware of).</div>

<div style='font: bold 9pt ; text-align: left; '>And for me, the whole process of trying to get the Ipod is like a challenge. I want to see if I can get it work. :)</div>