The Shrine

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>I applied to a bunch of places: MIT, Purdue, UMD, Penn State, UVA, Virginia Tech (where I'm an undergrad), and of course, William and Mary. You all know about the job market, but grad school is just as bad. I expected to get rejected by MIT, Purdue and UMD, but I did not expect to be flat-out rejected by Penn State and UVA. (Oh, I have a 3.6 in and out of major GPA, along with a minor in math and a minor in physics. I'm doing some programming languages research this semester.)

Virginia Tech accepted me, but did not offer me any assistance. I talked to my compilers professor about this, who also was one of the professors who gave me reccomendations, and he was surprised that a Tech graduate with a GPA greather than 3.5 and a U.S. citizen was turned away. (I was accepted, but not getting assistance is essentially the same thing.)

William and Mary offered me full tuition plus a position as a graduate assistant with comes with a stipend. So next fall, I will be in Williamsburg.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt "Fine Hand"; text-align: left; '>You should have said you're Half-Asian. =8^)</div>

<div style='font: 11pt "Fine Hand"; text-align: left; '><a href="http://www.cnn.com/2003/EDUCATION/04/14 ... >Click.</a>

<a href="http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/Northeast/03 ... $</a></div>

<div style='font: 12pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Cool, an assistanceship. I'm not surprised that you got rejected from so many schools though, a lot more people are going to grad school now instead of into this crappy market. I'm planning on getting my masters eventually (MS in MIS or MBA-MIS), but I'm going to give the job market a go first.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>Yup. Penn State said that they were only accepting people based on specific faculty research needs.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt Dominion; text-align: left; '>really? damn Penn State...oh well, guess you don't get to be the first tOWS to meet me ;) I'm in college of IST now anyway</div>

<div style='font: 14pt "Sans Serif"; text-align: justify; padding: 0% 15% 0% 15%; '>Congrats!</div>

<div style='font: 14pt "Sans Serif"; text-align: justify; padding: 0% 15% 0% 15%; '>Yep. I know someone who works for McKinsey. PhD in physics from Caltech. Yeah, they get paid phat $$$$....</div>

<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>Grats, man</div>

<div style='font: 9pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Major congrats! This calls for a celebration. *opens beer can*</div>

<div style='font: 12pt "Cooper Black"; text-align: left; '>Thats awesome, I dont think i could take another 2 years of school.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt "Cooper Black"; text-align: left; '>Accounting, baby. Most people in my graduating class of 60ish have a job out of college.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt "EngraversGothic BT", "Copperplate Gothic Light"; text-align: left; '>Masters? Damn, she's already an (cute) adult now. I remember when she was only 16 or so.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt "EngraversGothic BT", "Copperplate Gothic Light"; text-align: left; '>How good is W&M?</div>

<div style='font: 12pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Yeah Accountants are always needed... even if a company's going under, they need somebody to close up shop. If I can't find a job with my BS in MIS then I'm going back to get a BS in Acct... It'll only take 1 more year and I'll have the 150+ cr. hrs. needed to take the CPA exams.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Getting your masters doesn't always take 2 years, there are many contigencies (how well you do as an undergrad, what you majored in, how long ago, what school you go to and how many hours you take a semester), it could take anywhere from a year to 3.5 years to get a masters.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt "Cooper Black"; text-align: left; '>Its a great school. Its the 2nd oldest in the country i think? Very good reputation as an undergraduate college in Viginia. Not sure about graduate.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt "Cooper Black"; text-align: left; '>Virginia doesnt switch to the 150 credit hour rule until 2006. Hopefully i'll have it passed by then or it will be back to school for me. The Average is 2.4 tries, i think.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt "Times New Roman"; text-align: left; '>Good for you. Grad school is super important these days, it seems.</div>

<div style='font: 11pt "Fine Hand"; text-align: left; '>CUTE??????</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>It is a great school - but they're not known as a technical school. Not my first choice, but it's still a good school, I'll get a good graduate education, and I might be able to do it without any loans.</div>

<div style='font: ; text-align: left; '>One less person to compete with in the job market. Congrats.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>Yeah, well, two years from now, I'm going to have Master's in CS, so... :)</div>

<div style='font: 14pt "Times New Roman"; text-align: left; '>It'll backfire, you'll get told you're overqualified for jobs now. :-)</div>

<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Congrats....full assistance to boot</div>

<div style='font: 12pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Hell, if that happens he can go back for a couple more years and get his Phd, become a professor, and let his students worry about finding jobs. :)</div>

<div style='font: 10pt Baskerville; text-align: left; '>...but I can only speak from my own experience in that my company is almost non-stop hiring computer people, as are many of the other companies in my field. Customs brokerage being that field...with most companies having no choice but to get into the computer age, I'm surprised supply has already overrun demand...at least with a masters you should have no trouble landing 6 figures to start, and you can begin to reap the rewards of your hard work...

...anyway, good luck...</div>

<div style='font: 11pt Dominion; text-align: left; '>for programmers? yeah-- a lot of companies are outsourcing the jobs to India. My Uncle lost his job at GE to it and another Uncle manages a division of a company that's doing the same thing</div>

<div style='font: 12pt Arial; text-align: left; '>you think masters grads make 6 figures right out of school? lol! more like 60,000+ at most... unless you're talking Canadian.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt Arial; text-align: left; '>...hey where do you work? Maybe they'd hire me!</div>

<div style='font: ; text-align: left; '>...and I'll have two more years of experience. And it'll take a year or so to "ramp-up" to industry standards. Won't be too worried then. But then again, there might be enough jobs to go around in a couple of years...</div>

<div style='font: ; text-align: left; '>With the exception of a few elitist companies, most companies will judge you on your core programming competancy and communication abilities straight out of college. The only other big factor is industry experience. Other than that, most college grads won't have relevant experience to speak of and pretty much no technical ability. By technical ability I mean technologies that the industry uses at the time that colleges don't really teach.

Assuming Kupek is a good programmer, and if this were a more normal economy, he would probably end up making more in two years if he started a job now than his initial salary two years later with a Masters, especially if he knows how to play the system. I think a graduate degree is pretty much like grades. It helps a little getting into the door, but it largely doesn't matter after that. If you go for a PhD and really specialize in one aspect of Computer Science however, the game changes a little bit. And before you ask, I don't have a graduate degree. But when I was hired for my second job I made more than a co-worker who had a PhD.

But given the current economy, where there are practically no jobs available, the the ones that are available to new grads pay about as much as Taco Bell, it's not a bad idea to go to grad school, especially if it's practically free. Hopefully things pick up two years from now.

Regards,
Zhuge Liang</div>

<div style='font: 14pt "Times New Roman"; text-align: left; '>For the most part I think time is better spent picking up books and learning the new stuff like .NET in your spare hours. That and get a couple certs (but don't go bankrupt trying to get a ton). In my case, I'm hoping to get into CompUSA sometime next month, which despite having only sales positions open is still better than nothing.</div>

<div style='font: 14pt "Sans Serif"; text-align: justify; padding: 0% 15% 0% 15%; '>There are just too many technologies and they change too fast for colleges to be able to keep up these days. Yeah you know C++, but really, programming is all about knowing APIs and software packages these days, unless you are doing really low level stuff (and even then it's still about knowing APIs and software packages to a large extent).

Also, knowing a language and knowing how to <i>design</i> with a language is a distinction I really didn't get until I started working on large, non-trivial projects out of school. A lot of people who actually work in the industry don't get it and the vast majority of college graduates were like me (ie, they don't get it either).

And you're right about graduate degrees. Definitely don't do it just for the money, because as you said, with hard work, you'll be at or ahead of that point in two years just working in industry.

And you were pulling in more money than the PhD? hehe, did the PhD know this? :)</div>

<div style='font: 14pt "Sans Serif"; text-align: justify; padding: 0% 15% 0% 15%; '>Good idea. Always be learning new stuff. The more stuff you can do, the better off you'll be.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Do you have you bachelors??</div>

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>I'm getting a graduate degree because I want one (I like learning), not because I think it will net me a larger salary. I've already cut myself off from many job opportunities because I don't want to work for the DoD or DoD contractors.</div>

<div style='font: 14pt "Times New Roman"; text-align: left; '>Yeah, for close to a year now.</div>

<div style='font: 12pt Arial; text-align: left; '>In Computer Science or MIS? Either way, it sucks that there aren't any jobs besides CompUSA(!) that you can find... disheartening too.</div>

<div style='font: 10pt Baskerville; text-align: left; '>FedEx Trade Networks on the border between US and Canada...</div>

<div style='font: 10pt Baskerville; text-align: left; '>Maybe not right out but likely in a few years with a decent company...the masters should make getting in (the hard part) much easier...and 60,000 isn't exactly a low number...</div>

<div style='font: 10pt Baskerville; text-align: left; '><b>Link:</b> <a href="http://www.fedex.com/us/careers/areas/itd.html">Good luck</a>

Linkage...</div>

<div style='font: 14pt "Times New Roman"; text-align: left; '>Granted, I haven't had any luck at all with the classified ads, but I swear I'm going to kill myself if I have to stay another day here in Homer.</div>

<div style='font: 14pt "Times New Roman"; text-align: left; '>Granted, I haven't had any luck at all with the classified ads, but I swear I'm going to kill myself if I have to stay another day here in Homer.</div>