The Shrine

http://www.toplessrobot.com/2008/09/wil ... merica.php

Clearly I've been posting here too long, as the thought of Sine's reaction to this had me laughing quite hard.

I dunno. They made Ford Prefect black, and he turned out alright. However, Will Smith really doesn't have the frame for it. After all, Super Soldier Serum is supposed to bulk the Capt up. Will Smith isn't exactly muscular.

This could be another Daredevil, but I can give two shits about Captain America.


"Thumbs up, America!"

Fuck off, you lame asshole!

I'm not too keen on this just from a historical point of view. Even back in the 40's, there was still quite a bit of prejudice towards African Americans. There's no way a black guy would get chosen to receive the super soldier serum and become the symbol of America back then. I think they need to stick to the source material and not mess with it. That's the reason the Hulk and Iron Man were so great.

I couldn't care less if he's black, I just don't want him to be Will Smith

Lox wrote:I'm not too keen on this just from a historical point of view. Even back in the 40's, there was still quite a bit of prejudice towards African Americans. There's no way a black guy would get chosen to receive the super soldier serum and become the symbol of America back then.

Unless, of course, they thought there was a good chance it would kill or seriously harm the guy. In which case you pick someone you view as expendable.

As for physique, GIS him. He's bulked up for a few roles, and could easily pull off Captain America.

Personally, I don't think sticking to the source material is what has made the recent comic book movies great. It's more the people behind them decided they were going to make a good movie first, and a comic-book movie second.

Kupek wrote:Personally, I don't think sticking to the source material is what has made the recent comic book movies great. It's more the people behind them decided they were going to make a good movie first, and a comic-book movie second.

I have to disagree there and say that it was both of those things. Yeah, they decided to make good movies, but part of that was acknowledging that the existing back stories and history didn't need to be Hollywoodized. The reason most comic book movies have sucked is because the people making them didn't respect the source material. That was not the case with IM and TIH.

Kupek wrote:Unless, of course, they thought there was a good chance it would kill or seriously harm the guy. In which case you pick someone you view as expendable.

Maybe, but they still wouldn't have made him the face of the American effort against the Nazis.

I agree with the source material thing Kup, but Will Smith brings A LOT of baggage with him. They have to turn the role into a "Smith" roll, which means there has to be the one liners, the obligatory scenes to make him look cool, and they have to dumb down the role itself to play down to his abilities (he's basically Keanu Reeves or Bruce Willis in terms of ability). Basically, it would turn the flick into a flashy blockbuster and ignore the decent depth the recent comic book flicks have had, which is why they've been successful IMO.

Then when they market the movie, they have to market it to the Will Smith fans 'cause with his $30mil salary, expectations are through the roof. Which will also means it probably comes out during the Will Smith Weekend (July 4). Not a bad thing but just another thing that'll have to happen 'cause he's in a summer action flick.

Don't get me wrong, I don't hate Will Smith. But he's exactly what you don't want if you've liked the recent direction the comic book flicks have taken.

I am actually thinking this is about the best thing they could have done with the movie. From a marketing viewpoint, I am actually interested in seeing this; but as a viewer, I am not a fan of the comic, nor do I really know much about it besides a memory of the role he played in the Spider Man cartoons back in the 90's.

Maybe I'm in the minority, but even if IM and TIH were made as "good movies" but they completely disregarded the source material, I wouldn't have liked them. Or at least, I wouldn't have liked them very much.

Captain America being a white guy and the face of the stand against the Nazis is, to me, very fundamental to the character. He wasn't just a guy with super strength who ran around in a costume. And based on the time period, a black guy in that role doesn't make sense.

Edit: According to Ain't It Cool News, this was definitely just a rumor and nothing more. Count me happy if that's true.

http://www.aintitcool.com/node/38258

Me too. There's too much baggage with a big star like that. Even McConaughy would have ruined the character due to his persona and he's very low A-list at best. If it's gonna be a star it's gotta be someone who can become the role rather than someone for whom they have to alter the role for

Is Captain America from the 1940's something people would really want to see anyway? Spiderman and Batman have both been updated for current audiences, and both series' have been very popular.

Dutch wrote:Is Captain America from the 1940's something people would really want to see anyway? Spiderman and Batman have both been updated for current audiences, and both series' have been very popular.

Well, the origins for both Batman and Spiderman are much less tied to a time period than Captain America. Batman's parents could have been gunned down in any decade. The same goes for Spiderman getting his powers and his Uncle Ben being murdered. Like I said above, a huge part of Captain America is him being this symbol of America and freedom while fighting the evil, freedom-hating Nazi's. I can't think of another war since WWII where this country was as unified in the cause of winning the war. Vietnam, Korea, Desert Storm? None of those would work.

Plus, part of present day Captain America is that he is this symbol that vanished for decades and then reappears in a world that is very different from the one he knew. So, when they bring him back for the Avengers, he needs to have been gone for a while.

As for your question...yes, I think people would like to see that. The best Indiana Jones movies were the ones where he fought the Nazi's and those movies are still awesome to watch. There's no one better to root against than the Nazi's.

I'd have to agree. A big part of Captain America is that he's a part of a program from the past, he was put to sleep, then brought back. If you made the program originate in the Gulf War it would be kind dumb. Nazi's are as good a time as any and they've already got the crygenic freezing thing done to death in flicks, it would be passable for him to 'sleep' for 50 years

No. That is all. I say no to this.

there was another captain america. One of the guys who worked on the Super Soldier project used a group of black soldiers to try to recreate the formula and it worked on one of them. Isaiah Bradley. so yeah. I could see Will doing that.

Chris wrote:there was another captain america. One of the guys who worked on the Super Soldier project used a group of black soldiers to try to recreate the formula and it worked on one of them. Isaiah Bradley. so yeah. I could see Will doing that.

Yeah, that would work better. I could see that being worked in as part of the story since Isaiah gets captured afterwards.

Chris wrote:there was another captain america. One of the guys who worked on the Super Soldier project used a group of black soldiers to try to recreate the formula and it worked on one of them. Isaiah Bradley. so yeah. I could see Will doing that.

Sure, just don't use Will Smith. Give me a guy without any baggage or expectations, that's all I want

Lox wrote:I think they need to stick to the source material and not mess with it. That's the reason the Hulk and Iron Man were so great.

I don't think they exactly stuck with the source material in either of those movies. It will more than likely be modernized, like those two.

SineSwiper wrote:

Lox wrote:I think they need to stick to the source material and not mess with it. That's the reason the Hulk and Iron Man were so great.

I don't think they exactly stuck with the source material in either of those movies. It will more than likely be modernized, like those two.

What do you mean modernized? Have you actually read an issue of Hulk or Iron Man lately? Based on precedent with you, I'm guessing not. There was nothing to modernize besides IM's origin (which can be modernized similar to Batman & Spiderman without a problem). Sure, they adapted the plot to fit a movie, but the important characters and their personalities were right out of the comics. I could care less if they invent some story about what Captain America does during WWII, but they better keep the character close to the comic.

It's not really a huge deal. Will Smith was great starring in I Robot, which was far, FAR from the source material.

Dutch wrote:It's not really a huge deal. Will Smith was great starring in I Robot, which was far, FAR from the source material.

that was a terrible movie but while WIll Smith is a prettyboy actor he's a damn good actor. Hell I am Legend was great up until more people came into the movie.

Like I said before, Smith is very limited acting-wise. He's a plug like Reeves and Willis. Their strength is picking roles (hit and miss; each has hit extremely well, though), looking cool, and acting within their abilities. Johnny Depp these people ain't. Don't mean they don't do good flicks but don't ever mistaken that with good acting ability

It's not like I think the role of Cap needs Depp, I just don't want an actor who brings baggage with him like Smith, McConaughy, or DiFaggio. A guy like Tim Roth is perfect, actually. He's been used up already, though

My vote goes to Dolph Lundgren personally.

I don't know Zeus; I felt he did a very good job in a lot of roles. It's best not to just focus on his blockbuster roles either; just my opinion, but I felt In Pursuit of Happiness was a great movie. I would NOT compare him to Reeves or Willis, his best and worst are higher than their best and worst.

Even in his Fresh Prince days he had some great moments

He's fun and can act to a certain degree, just like Willis and Reeves. I loved Fresh Prince, I watched it right from the beginning. I actually like Smith. But he's limited. He never really "makes" a role, he fits into one. If you tried to give him a role like Jack Sparrow (where the performance makes the role not vice versa) he would have just ended up as a decent character rather than a memorable one. It's the same with Willis and Reeves. All these guys, their strength is in picking movies not in performance.

And Smith brings a ton of baggage and expectations which is awful for a role like Cap.

And you can't sit there and tell me with a straight face that Smith has had better "bests" than Matrix, Die Hard, Sixth Sense, etc. He may have made more money but that's a different matter altogether

Zeus wrote:And you can't sit there and tell me with a straight face that Smith has had better "bests" than Matrix, Die Hard, Sixth Sense, etc. He may have made more money but that's a different matter altogether

Yes I can actually

Search up on my previous posts, I felt those movies were all terrible. The only good thing about Die Hard is Rickman, the rest of the cast played nearly retarded characters.... it was the classic story of retarded good over genius evil

I understand the rest of your post.... BUT.... For a Captain America movie, I think Will Smith would be better suited to the role than Johnny Depp, Keannu Reeves, or Bruce Willis. I also don't think it would get much of an audience without a known actor.

Better than Depp? You're a madman

The audience is Captain America not Will Smith. He would bring in a whole bunch of people who aren't Cap fans which would, in turn, ensure that the filmmakers alter the film for Will Smith fans. This is what people who care about the source material don't want

Zeus wrote:Better than Depp? You're a madman

The audience is Captain America not Will Smith. He would bring in a whole bunch of people who aren't Cap fans which would, in turn, ensure that the filmmakers alter the film for Will Smith fans. This is what people who care about the source material don't want

You think Johnny Depp would make a great Captain America?

Dutch wrote:

Zeus wrote:Better than Depp? You're a madman

The audience is Captain America not Will Smith. He would bring in a whole bunch of people who aren't Cap fans which would, in turn, ensure that the filmmakers alter the film for Will Smith fans. This is what people who care about the source material don't want

You think Johnny Depp would make a great Captain America?

He would definitely fit into the source material far better than Smith. And he doesn't bring any baggage or expectations with him

But I wouldn't personally choose him for the role.

Chris wrote:that was a terrible movie but while WIll Smith is a prettyboy actor he's a damn good actor. Hell I am Legend was great up until more people came into the movie.

The alt ending of I Am Legend was MUCH better.

Also, I think that Wil Smith is a very good actor, and he can show his dynamic well. People like Eddie Murphy are the type that just seems to do the same role over and over. Now that he's old as shit, and making shitty movies, it's easy to tell that.

And enough with the Keanu hate. Look at his roles from Bill and Ted, Point Break, Matrix, Constantine, and Much Ado about Nothing. They are all different. Just because you can't get over his role in B&T doesn't mean he's a bad actor.