The Shrine

If Blizzard has its way, that will be no more:

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6146692.html

This is ridiculous, period. This guy didn't work for them and wasn't privy to any additional info due to any affiliations as per the article (which I'm sure would have mentioned it). Basically, what Blizzard is trying to stop (under the DMCA, I might add) is that NO unauthorized guides sold for profit are allowed.

I have three words for you Blizzard: The Dummies series. If this lawsuit wins, my already extraordinarily low faith in any legal system on this continent plummets any further. Hell, I look on my shelf right now and I see a who whack of "unauthorized" guides. Mind you, none from this generation.......

The family law case involving my neice coming up on the 3rd may just eliminate any and all faith period.

There will still be unauthorized guides. Just none that will be sold. This has been fought over before and the company usually comes out on top.

I'm afraid I'm going to have to disagree with you here Zeus. There is no reason why a company should be allowed selling and profiting on guides to a videogame without consent of the developer/publisher (if the developer publisher does not want it done). First of all, it is using the licesnse of another company to make money. Then there is always quality issues to consider as well. A company should at least look for consent before pulling stuff like this. If they the prosection loses this case, I am going to go out and make my own unauthorized guides for the Final Fantasy games and undercut the prices of the official guides by a large enough % that people will only look at my label "Seeking the Way."

Zeus is right on this one, i think. Disallowing 3rd party guides would open up a whole shit load of worms...

Consider what he said about the Dummy series books. If i wanted to go write a book on how ot make money by investing in Schwab mutual funds or how to properly maintain a Kawakasi motorcycle i wouldnt be allowed... If all guides have to be straight from the source (or allowed by the source), then that would conflict with free enterprise and competition.

I still disagree.

Flip wrote:Zeus is right on this one, i think. Disallowing 3rd party guides would open up a whole shit load of worms...

Consider what he said about the Dummy series books. If i wanted to go write a book on how ot make money by investing in Schwab mutual funds or how to properly maintain a Kawakasi motorcycle i wouldnt be allowed...

Only this is about unauthorized guides being sold for a creative work: a videogame.

Flip wrote:If all guides have to be straight from the source (or allowed by the source), then that would conflict with free enterprise and competition.

I don't agree with the relevence of this statement on the grounds that the examples cited above do not fall into the category of creative works; which videogames do. A company can not make an unlicensed/unconsented "Atlas for Middle Earth" or "Encyclopedia for Middle Earth" with the purpose of sale.

The Seeker wrote:I still disagree.

Flip wrote:Zeus is right on this one, i think. Disallowing 3rd party guides would open up a whole shit load of worms...

Consider what he said about the Dummy series books. If i wanted to go write a book on how ot make money by investing in Schwab mutual funds or how to properly maintain a Kawakasi motorcycle i wouldnt be allowed...

Only this is about unauthorized guides being sold for a creative work: a videogame.

Flip wrote:If all guides have to be straight from the source (or allowed by the source), then that would conflict with free enterprise and competition.

I don't agree with the relevence of this statement on the grounds that the examples cited above do not fall into the category of creative works; which videogames do. A company can not make an unlicensed/unconsented "Atlas for Middle Earth" or "Encyclopedia for Middle Earth" with the purpose of sale.

So, all the Dummies books should be banned as well?

Then what about sites like GameFAQs whose primary draw are their guides and they make money (from advertising) from it. They provide the medium for people to write guides and it would be sad to see them go down.

Even strategy articles and tidbits in magezines would fall under this umbrella since people pay for magezines.

This is just Blizzard being Blizzard and they will not win this case.

Flip wrote:Then what about sites like GameFAQs whose primary draw are their guides and they make money (from advertising) from it. They provide the medium for people to write guides and it would be sad to see them go down.

Even strategy articles and tidbits in magezines would fall under this umbrella since people pay for magezines.

This is just Blizzard being Blizzard and they will not win this case.

Oh, I agree with you fully. It's an insanely frivolous case that should have no business even being heard, nonetheless winning. The far-reachiong effects of a ruling in Blizzard's favour would be ridiculous.

Which, in US courts, gives it a 50-50 shot of going in Blizzard's favour :-)

Zeus wrote:So, all the Dummies books should be banned as well?

So far I haven't seen any books called "A walkthrough of Final Fantasy for Dummies" or "An Encyclopedia to Middle Earth for Dummies"

Flip wrote:Then what about sites like GameFAQs whose primary draw are their guides and they make money (from advertising) from it. They provide the medium for people to write guides and it would be sad to see them go down.

Gamefaqs is not directly selling its guides. It is similar to how unauthorized guides to middle earth can be found online. The fair usage doctrine, which has been adopted interationally, permits the copying and distribution of creative works and for non-exploitative purposes so long as the original authors are acknowledged (something which all FAQs do). If a game company took Gamfaqs to court on the grounds that their FAQs on a certain game had too much of an impact on the copyrighted material in the marketplace, then it is possible that the courts would force Gamefaqs to take specific guides down for the specific title in question; as far as my knowledge, I do not think any company has found this to be the case.

About tidbits in magazines, that is an interesting question; I am not sure the answer to it. I do recall some similar cases where a company successfully sued a videogame company as well as videogame magazines over the printing of their name. So perhaps it is not legal, but it might be that most companies see this as good advertisement for their products; so the benefit clearly outweighs the bad in these cases.

For the record, I too would be upset if Gamefaqs was forced to go under. I don't read the walkthrough portions, but I frequently do read up character advancement (so I have an idea of how I want to develop my characters in a particular game, such as FFT, FF8, Fire Emblem, or Ogre Battle).

The Seeker wrote:

Zeus wrote:So, all the Dummies books should be banned as well?

So far I haven't seen any books called "A walkthrough of Final Fantasy for Dummies" or "An Encyclopedia to Middle Earth for Dummies"

Seek, it's THE SAME FREAKIN' THING. A book entitled "Winblows for Dummies" and one that shows you screen pics of the program and tells you how to do things is no different than someone making an "Unauthorized Final Fantasy 3 Guide" and telling you how to get through the game and showing screens of certain places.

In both cases, you're showing screens of copyrighted software and adding your own text. This is the basis of Blizzard's argument, that the person is using images of copyrighted material to make a profit. My issue was that Ebay simply folded under the pressure, which seems to be their policy, rather than actually look at the merits of the complaint to determine if it has any validity. They simply don't want the hassle of litigation, plain and simple.

You can't have a problem with one thing and not the other. Same shit, different pile.

A Windows for dummies book most likely has permission from Microsoft. If whoever owns the copyright says it's fine you're certainly free to write whatever.

Due to the number of games at Gamefaqs, it'd be difficult to show that it's because we have some FAQs for one game that's why Gamefaqs is making money. So at worst they'd take down all the FAQs for a particular game if a company sued. Now if the whole gaming industry sued GameFAQs they can probably take it down, but that'd probably harm the industry more than it helps, which is why you don't see it being done.

Don Wang wrote:A Windows for dummies book most likely has permission from Microsoft. If whoever owns the copyright says it's fine you're certainly free to write whatever.

Most likely? I somehow doubt that all of the Dummies books based on copyrighted materials - as well as all of the knock-off books, such as the Complete Idiots Guide series, as written for Ish - have gotten permission from the copyright holder. Same with all of the magazines that review or promote products showing off screens of the respective materials.

If that were the case, there would be no new magazines on anything then and they would be MUCH more expensive. Same with newspaper articles covering new products.

Really, it would be impossible to require permission....

Zeus wrote:Most likely? I somehow doubt that all of the Dummies books based on copyrighted materials have gotten permission from the copyright holder.

I did some research on the company that does the "for Dummies" series at www.wiley.com under the "contact us" section. All of their material which covers copyrighted material has the permission of the publisher. So Windows for Dummies would indeed have Microsoft's permission (along with any other similar work). it is a specific guideline for the company. I see no reason to doubt that all of the materials do indeed follow this specific guideline.