The Shrine

This was initially going to be two posts, but the two points here go hand-in hand.

First of all, God of War 2 amazing. Everything you loved about the first game is here and done bigger and better. This is one of the best games I've ever played and probably the most enjoyable I've ever played on the PS2. The puzzles, combat, level design, and art direction come together so tightly that in my opinion anybody who does not love the game does not love videogames in general. I know that's quite a statement but I truly believe and stand by it. Any concerns about the absence of David Jaffe are washed away within the first ten minutes.

I played through on God Mode (hard) and although I got my ass handed to me no less than twenty times, I never found the AI to be cheap. It was always a case of me failing to do the right thing at the right time or putting myself in a deadly position (like rolling between two minotaurs in mid swing, for instance).

So I loved it. Play it.

Second point has to do with the state of first party games. Tycho brought this up in a recent entry on Penny-Arcade:

One of the attack vectors against Sony is that they moved slowly and this caused them to lose many exclusives. Even at the dizzy height of my rage against them, I never found this line of reasoning especially compelling. Even hearing that Metal Gear might go to a Microsoft system - and it's not as though there's no precedent - doesn't especially shock me. To be honest, I would be happy if this game appeared on less than one platform. But for the longtime gaming enthusiast, what Sony can deliver as a first party has the power to compel - and this was before they started siphoning the cream of independent game development.Think seriously about the franchises and teams they represent, and then ask yourself how Nintendo is considered the king of in-house development.

What do you guys think? Since the death of the Dreamcast, Nintendo has been known for putting out the best first party games in the industry. Think about the Playstation (one) and some of the stuff that came out of Sony then that wasn't called Gran Turismo: Blasto, MediEval, Syphon Filter, Twisted Metal, Jet Moto, Warhawk, their various sports titles. While some of those games were garbage, some were pretty good for the time, but have aged pretty poorly. I remember being amazed with games like Toshinden, Twisted Metal (the first two), and the first few NFL Gamedays but playing them years later was painful (especially Gameday). Part of this can be attributed to early 3D gaming which, in general, is quite rough to play through now.

But anyway, let's look at Sony now. God of War, SOCOM (is that an acronym?), Jak & Daxter, Ratchet & Clank, Resistance: FOM. To be perfectly honest, I've only played God of War of these bunch and none of the others. And given the lack of posts from anybody else here about the rest of them, I'm guessing few of you have either. However, they are all well received by the media and fans alike and all have sold really well.


Microsoft's list of first and second party games is also becoming more and more impressive (more so with the 360), and Nintendo is... well, Nintendo.

Chime in, bitches. Do you think Nintendo still holds the crown of first party development despite your respective biases? Or have Sony and/or Microsoft caught up with or surpassed them? If we could not mention the portable market here I'd appreciate it. If not... well go ahead, I can't stop you.

Also, with the recent news that Devil May Cry is now coming to the 360, would you like to see MGS4 and FF13 on the 360? Do you think it will happen? (EDIT: wait, this is already a thread of its own)

I've been thinking that while some people may poo-poo the motion controls of the Sixaxis, just wait to see how Kojima and Konami use it in MGS4. Remember how MGS used the Dual Shock when it was first introduced?

There's absolutely no doubt in my mind that there's no comparison with Nintendo, on a quality or sales level, as a first-party developer:

1) Worldwide, EA, a third party, is the only company which anywhere close to them in sales.....and they're about half.

2) Yes, Sony and Microshaft have had some great games in the last couple of generations, but the vast majority have been third party and lots of second party. Gran Turismo, my fav Sony published game, is made by Polyphony. And most of the games you mentioned were either Insomniac or Naughty Dog. This is why Crash left. Shitphon Filter doesn't count 'cause it sucks so hard but SOCOM is very good and very popular, but I'm not sure who makes it.

Halo is by Bungie which we'll give you as a first-party even though they were bought out in the middle of the first game's development and were a third party before that. Gears is Epic and regardless of what it may be, I still say that's third party (it may officially be a second party).

Very few of Nintendo's titles, especially the bigger ones, can be considered anything but first party. Certain games that are great, like Elite Beat Agents and Mario Golf are second party, but the majority of their really good stuff (and no one can deny there's lots of it other than Kali) is first party

3) It's fact that Sony's success has been based on third party support, this is why there are so many gloom and doom articles whenever they lose their big third-party games as exclusives. What made the PSX successful? Well, it started with stuff like RE and Tekken, then moved to MGS and FF7, then things like Gran Turismo came along. So, third party built the basis and mostly carried it through. The PS2 had a garbage launch (Tekken Tag was the best game for cryin' out loud) and it was stuff like Grand Theft Auto and sports and RPGs that boosted it along with Jak and Ratchet. No sports from the third party 989 either, they're dead. So, same thing, mostly third party with a little more second party to help

The real question is: what do they have to offer than Microshaft doesn't? We know that Halo is exclusive and it's huge. Nintendo has Mario and it's franchises which always give it sales. Sony's lost it's previous money maker in Grand Theft Auto as it's launching on 360 first. Their aces in the hole were FF13 and MGS4 which are HUGE titles that, until recently, were exclusives. And they lost things like Assassin's Creed and DMC4 which were supposed to fill the gaps of a lot of the lost exclusives.

What's left? Right now, if they lose MGS4, I have zero reason to get a PS3 since between the 360 and Wii I'll be able to play every game I want. As it is I wouldn't pay $700 to play MGS4 anyways but I may have at least rented one.

What's the difference between first and second party developers? When was the last time you saw Polyphony or Insomniac develop for somebody other than Sony? Or Bioware and Bungie develop for somebody other than Microsoft? Or HAL or Retro not develop for Nintendo? That's not the point.

And I'm not arguing that Sony's past success is NOT based on third party titles. That much is obvious.

Black Lotus wrote:What's the difference between first and second party developers? When was the last time you saw Polyphony or Insomniac develop for somebody other than Sony? Or Bioware and Bungie develop for somebody other than Microsoft? Or HAL or Retro not develop for Nintendo? That's not the point.

And I'm not arguing that Sony's past success is NOT based on third party titles. That much is obvious.

Silicon Knights was a second-party developer as was Rare.

The difference is, a second-party has the option to leave. They may not have any reason to like Rare did throughout the N64 days but that don't mean it won't happen.

Look at Crash Bandicoot