The Shrine

Spoilers are left unhidden here.








I beat the game yesterday with the good ending. The ending was real short, but there wasn't much further you could do with it, so it was good enough. The twist in the game was great, and totally unexpected, even with the clues given out in the beginning.

Did anybody catch the genetic link between the hero and Ryan? That's the reason why the Vita-Chambers and B'Spheres work. Apparently, the stripper that Ryan killed (in a ghost scene) was the hero's mother. (There's a single audio diary that alludes to it elsewhere.)

I think I'm going to really write a Character Bio FAQ. I planned on doing it with System Shock 2, but nobody transposed any of the diary text from the game. But, somebody has wrote an audio diary guide on BioShock, so I have reference material. However, unlike SS2, BioShock doesn't have any dates on the diaries, so it's going to be a harder task to piece the order of certain events.

I finished it yesterday afternoon... the ending was sappy but nice. One thing I didn't get, though, was didn't they say that once you started using Adam you had to keep getting more or you'd go insane and turn into a splicer? How did the main character continue to have a normal life for at least a few decades afterwards? Did he take a store of it with him? And shouldn't he still be a Big Daddy, or was Fontaine lying about it not being a "two way street" ?

I (actually more a firend of mine) figured from the beginning that Atlas was Fontaine... and I thought about it but the bastard was too good of an actor for me. The twist itself was awesome... and I didn't even think of the Vita-chambers (if that's so then how did Ryan die? He shoulda resurrected at a Vita-Chamber too) but the bathospheres? Didn't know they were controlled by DNA.


I'm tempted to go back to a pre-last little sister save (if I have one), kill it, and get the other ending... but I don't think I have one. I assume the bad ending has you taking Fontaine's place and ruling Rapture. Speaking of which... in the good ending wtf happens to Rapture? We just leave it at the bottom of the sea? Seems kinda... neglectful.

Tessian wrote:I finished it yesterday afternoon... the ending was sappy but nice.

Yeah, I loved the good ending. I wish they'd rolled credits after it though. Being dumped straight back to the title screen felt a bit wrong.

Tessian wrote:One thing I didn't get, though, was didn't they say that once you started using Adam you had to keep getting more or you'd go insane and turn into a splicer?

Not quite. The game talks about how the splicers still in Rapture had driven themselves insane by splicing too heavily, not through splicing and then stopping.

There is a tape (in Arcadia, I think?) in which one of the characters talks about the negative effects of splicing though, but the ending doesn't explain whether Jack suffered from these.

Tessian wrote:And shouldn't he still be a Big Daddy, or was Fontaine lying about it not being a "two way street"?

Sort of!

You find a couple of tapes at Point Prometheus that explain the Big Daddification process, and for the Big Daddies you see wandering around Rapture it would have been a one-way process: their organs and stuff get grafted to the suit. But all you do is put the suit on: the only permanent thing you have done is that voicebox modification. So at worst Jack will sound like a whale for the rest of his life.

...and I didn't even think of the Vita-chambers (if that's so then how did Ryan die? He shoulda resurrected at a Vita-Chamber too)

Heh - if you actually go around the back of Ryan's office you find his Vita-chamber and can see that it's actually been deactivated. It's the only one in the game you have to activate yourself. My theory is that the Vita-chambers have a minimum range, and Ryan was out of range of all activated chambers (having actually wanted to die, and having turned his own Vita-chamber off).

I assume the bad ending has you taking Fontaine's place and ruling Rapture.

Sort of:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=UUUpkaUsNoY

Speaking of which... in the good ending wtf happens to Rapture? We just leave it at the bottom of the sea? Seems kinda... neglectful.

Bring on Bioshock 2!

One awesome thing about the Big Daddy suit: if you cruise around the rest of Rapture while you have it on, only the Houdini splicers in Arcadia will attack you; everybody else thinks you're a Big Daddy and so leaves you alone, heh.

That clip sucked quality wise... but I loved the premise. They need to base Bioshock 2 off of THAT. A world being invaded by splicers.

The main character would be Tantabaum's ace in the hole, and you're sent off to stop the invasion and eventually destroy the main character of this one a la Diablo 2. I rock

Tessian wrote:The twist itself was awesome... and I didn't even think of the Vita-chambers (if that's so then how did Ryan die? He shoulda resurrected at a Vita-Chamber too) but the bathospheres? Didn't know they were controlled by DNA.

Actually, you had to turn on the Vita-Chamber after you killed him in his area. It didn't dawn on me what that meant until you told me. I guess he turned if off on purpose because he thought the end to be inevitable.

As far as the second one, it was a diary under the platform (wading through water) in the second area. I heard it, but I didn't really understood it until after the end.

Tessian wrote:I'm tempted to go back to a pre-last little sister save (if I have one), kill it, and get the other ending... but I don't think I have one. I assume the bad ending has you taking Fontaine's place and ruling Rapture. Speaking of which... in the good ending wtf happens to Rapture? We just leave it at the bottom of the sea? Seems kinda... neglectful.

Oh yeah, I think I have one somewhere, but it might be a ways into it. Kinda pissed that I was one step away from getting the All Tracks Filled achievement. Also, I missed a bunch of Power to the People stations. Apparently, there is 12 out there, so you could full max out all of your weapons.

Did you get the Irony achievement? I killed Cohen, and just on a whim, took his picture (since I was taking pictures of his enemies), and it said that I got the Irony achievement. Funny as hell when I saw it.

SineSwiper wrote: Did you get the Irony achievement? I killed Cohen, and just on a whim, took his picture (since I was taking pictures of his enemies), and it said that I got the Irony achievement. Funny as hell when I saw it.

Damnit! Didn't even cross my mind... so THAT's the last secret one I'm missing

I got all tracks bought (tonics/plasmids) but I think I missed 3 upgrade stations...

Don't kill Cohen if you want to upgrade every weapon! You need to leave him alive to get access to his (incredibly terrifying) room at the Mercury Suites.

Andrew, Killer Bee wrote:Don't kill Cohen if you want to upgrade every weapon! You need to leave him alive to get access to his (incredibly terrifying) room at the Mercury Suites.

The Wild Bunny by Sander Cohen: I want to take the ears off, but I can't. I hop, and when I hop, I never get off the ground. It's my curse, my eternal curse! I want to take the ears off but I can't! It's my fucking curse! I want to take the ears off! Please! Take them off! Please!

Oh, and I hear there's a way to kill him if you wait long enough. I just said "Fuck it" as he went down the stairs, but I didn't really get that Medical Tonic, probably because of that. And it didn't dawn on me to check his room again.

you could just save it before you kill him to get the achievement and then load it up and not kill him to get the weapon upgrade.

You had the option of NOT killing him?? Damn... I opened fire almost as soon as he appeared cause that stupid ass wanted to make me the last part.

SineSwiper wrote:And it didn't dawn on me to check his room again.

You're not thinking of the right room . If you don't kill him, you get access to his room in his actual apartment at the Mercury Suites. I don't know if you recall it, but it had two people dancing at its far end.

If you leave Cohen alive at Fort Frolic, when you kill those two dancers he unlocks the door to his room and tries to kill you, and you then have access to his room and weapon upgrade station.

bovine wrote:you could just save it before you kill him to get the achievement and then load it up and not kill him to get the weapon upgrade.

Yeah, I did this, but it felt like cheating .

Tessian wrote:You had the option of NOT killing him?? Damn...

Heh, on my first play-through I killed him as soon as he gave me access to that tonic. So satisfying.

You know, one semi-major gripe I have with the game is that there was less replay value in Bioshock than System Shock 2. In Bioshock, you can get and keep all of the weapons in the game, upgrade every weapon, get every plasmid (at least all of the different types), and while you have limited slots, you can get just about every tonic in the game.

In System Shock 2, you have a limited number of slots to store items, so you can only hold so many weapons. You had a limited about of Cybernetic Modules, so you could only upgrade so many weapons and PSI abilities. So, in replaying the game, not only did you see surprises in the storyline, you also got to play the game much differently than the last time, ie: all weapons, half PSI/weapons, try to find the best build, etc.

Granted, I'll probably play it again on Hard to try to get all of the achievements, but I don't really have a "build" in mind, because I've tried a lot during the first game.

SineSwiper wrote:You know, one semi-major gripe I have with the game is that there was less replay value in Bioshock than System Shock 2.

I've never really played System Shock 2, but I'm on my third run-through of Bioshock now so I'm pretty happy with its replay value. There are just so many ways to have fun: I mean, on this third time through I've cleared Neptune's Bounty using pretty much telekinesis only.

So much thought has gone into the environment design: there are always explosive canisters, pools of water, pools of oil, cameras and turrets, and just random stuf in every combat area. You can replay every battle over and over again, completely differently. It's a bit like a multiplayer or sandbox game in this way.

I know I posted it on another thread, but this review is worth repeating. It really illustrates everything wrong with the game.

Tessian wrote:You had the option of NOT killing him?? Damn... I opened fire almost as soon as he appeared cause that stupid ass wanted to make me the last part.

You mean you didn't actually notice that? When he was coming down to check out his masterpiece I let him go and waited to see what happened. I was actually shocked that my aim cursor turned red while he was still talking. So I let it run and he just gave me something and left. I was half expecting him to attack me so i was all ready to waste him but was never given a reason to.

BTW, did you get the secret achievement that's NOT story-based (is actually a secret)? One of the most brilliant achievements I've ever heard of.

Sine, game's reply factor could just be in its awesomeness and not necessarily extra content. I mean, there is the 122 audio journal to find (I got 115 of the my first time through; just used a FAQ to get the rest) if you really NEED something, but you should be getting that your first time through as you explore and not just running through the game. The 7 I missed were the few areas I didn't explore in the beginning. At the end of the day it's just so damned fun you WANT to play it again. I'm only missing the "beat it on hard" achievement and I may just get it 'cause the game ruled so much.

One area where they could have improved the game was in the story twists. There just wasn't enough and there were some WICKED places for some. After you kill Ryan and are escaping and the girls are helping you, well, they don't actually have to based on your actions (ie. saving vs harvesting). The whole ending sequence going to Fontaine could (should?) have had something to do with Tennenbaum. It would have been nice to see her invovled a bit more at the end. And the whole sequence after you beat Fontaine could have also changed based on the whole saving vs harvesting choice.

Minor gripe but it could have made an awesome game that much better.

It's open-ended like that for a sequel or expansion obviously.

Zeus, you talking about the Irony one?

Tessian wrote:Zeus, you talking about the Irony one?

Yeah. I fucking love that one

I DID get that one... but not the other since I didn't let him live obviously

You can always let him live and kill him at his apt. You'll still get both bonuses and his weapon upgrade station.

I've just beat it on hard. The difficulty wasn't all that hard. Sure, a lot of the enemies were resistance to bullets, but it seemed like I was using the tonic-upgraded wrench a lot more with those enemies. Nothing like a couple of quick whacks to sent them to the ground.

Also, I didn't manually hack nearly as much. The research upgrades allowed me to auto-hack turrets and bots. I usually bought the hacks for cameras, and used an hack tool for vendors and most safes. I put in all of the tonics for lowering difficulty, so that the stuff that I didn't auto-hack was cheap to buy off, or at least doable to manually hack. Even with all of that, my wallet was full for most of the end game.

I noticed on the last battle that you actually get Adam from Fontaine, but I didn't see a station where you could spend it. Might be good for trying to get the tonic achievement. Anyway, I've got 900 points; I'm missing that one and the historian. (Might not be able to get that one because the damn game removed a diary that I know I picked up.)

SineSwiper wrote:(Might not be able to get that one because the damn game removed a diary that I know I picked up.)

Since you mentioned this, has anybody come accross any bugs in the game? I've heard tell of crashes, big daddies stuck in walls/disappearing, little sisters not spawning, and others. I didn't experience anything that could be construed any way as a bug or glitch in my 1.5 playthroughs.

And those bugs I mentioned were mentioned for the 360 version. I know there are others on the PC, but I think we're all playing it on the 360 here.

No bugs that I saw

No bugs for me, but I did get stuttering that was fixed with a cache clear (the stuttering appeared much more frequently after the game update).

after the update, I do the cache-clearing, but it gets jumpy after about an hour. I haven't been able to play through it again because I consider that situation to be unplayable. I hope they come out with an update sometime soon so I can blaze through it again.

Black Lotus wrote:

SineSwiper wrote:(Might not be able to get that one because the damn game removed a diary that I know I picked up.)

Since you mentioned this, has anybody come accross any bugs in the game? I've heard tell of crashes, big daddies stuck in walls/disappearing, little sisters not spawning, and others. I didn't experience anything that could be construed any way as a bug or glitch in my 1.5 playthroughs.

And those bugs I mentioned were mentioned for the 360 version. I know there are others on the PC, but I think we're all playing it on the 360 here.

In celebration of getting my 360 back finally, I picked up Bioshock (and NHL 08 ) and played through it once - good ending. Mmmm...all nighter.

I had a few bugs, but luckily they ended up being beneficial or at least not game breaking.

- I found two extra Little Sisters
- I could keep photographing certain enemies and getting an A screen even when maxed
- Cohen's body disappeared almost immediately, so I couldn't grab the Irony achievement (maybe not a bug - I was using my iced wrench at the time).