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Sega releases just as many duds as it does hits. But it is doing relatively OK as a publisher.Legend of The Seeker wrote:I do think it was a combo of poor timing and the boot disk.
Anyway, I read the article. To this day Skies of Adcadia remains my favourite RPG, and Soul Calibur my favourite fighter. Sega is starting to recover, though, with knew highly discussed upcoming franchises.
Replay wrote:the DC was most underrated and i want to buy one at some point, i bet someday they'll be worth as much as they were when they were being actively sold. i had fun times on my roommate's dc at stanford...man.
the 360 is sort of morphing into a spiritual successor to it, i think, though, so that makes me VERY happy.
look at me. I am making a post.Replay wrote:@Zeus: my Saturn was the shit. i wish to god sega had been able to actually get other developers to make games for it.
this also doesn't need responding to.bovine wrote:Replay wrote:the DC was most underrated and i want to buy one at some point, i bet someday they'll be worth as much as they were when they were being actively sold. i had fun times on my roommate's dc at stanford...man.
the 360 is sort of morphing into a spiritual successor to it, i think, though, so that makes me VERY happy.look at me. I am making a post.Replay wrote:@Zeus: my Saturn was the shit. i wish to god sega had been able to actually get other developers to make games for it.
I now have another point to make, possibly at someone new, now I have just pressed the edit button and gone back to my old post to add to it.
Oh look at me, editing once more. Now I can say that since I have three separate things to say in a row before anyone else has posted, I can make all of these statements in the nice, comfortable setting of a single post. No multiple posts streaming down the page to take up bovine's valuable scrolling finger. I can say all I need to say in a single post. Look at me, I'm the fucking king of posting town. Postington some call it.
and back to actually contributing to things...Zeus wrote:And I must be one of the few who has fond memories of his Saturn. That wasn't a particularly good system technologically but it had some awesome games for it. And if you imported, it had EASILY the best fighting games on it 'til the DC took over that crown.
bovine wrote:in terms of the Dreamcast, I didn't get one until well after it crashed and burned, so I don't have any sort of appreciation for it. I though the controller was awful, the memory card and rumble pack still being seperate and requiring batteries was stupid, and a large percentage of the games were awful. Anything that was good either continued on in sequel form (SC) or got ported (SoA, G2, and kinda jetset radio). It was the Saturn that suffered the most since pretty much none of the original IPs that hit it really found a home anywhere else, the exeptions being the panzer dragoon on the xbox and the nights game on the wii (or the remake of the original nights for the ps2, but only released in japan).
I think the dreamcast is overrated if anything.
One was made, and it was called Shadow of the Colossus.The Seekrshank Redemption wrote:someone should make a game where you fight only major bosses but don't need to slaughter hordes of peons throughout the game in order to stay fit enough to get through.
I think you mean Chu Chu Rocket. Boom Boom Rocket was that shiet game on XBLA from EA that came with the Arcade disc.Seraphina wrote:I remember playing a lot of Tony Hawk, Crazy Taxi, and Boom Boom Rockets. I think we had an emulator for it for nes and snes games as well.
Listen to the PhD student. Colossus was one of the best games of last generation and it was nothing other than finding and beating 16 BIG ASS bosses. It was incredible.Kupek wrote:One was made, and it was called Shadow of the Colossus.The Seekrshank Redemption wrote:someone should make a game where you fight only major bosses but don't need to slaughter hordes of peons throughout the game in order to stay fit enough to get through.
It's only a small core of fans who "overrate" the DC. It's a mostly forgotten system by the majority of gamers (and ex-gamers). But if you look at the games that system had (I'll send you a list of the ones I have sometime) in the short period of time it was out and I don't think there's been any system that compares in its first two years. There are tons of classic and just awesome games even if they weren't too popular or were vastly underappreciated. Sega probably released its greatest diversity and arguably greatest quality of games on that system, many of which most haven't heard of. And it's still probably the best system for fighting games and one of the best for shooters. Not to mention it was the first to have truly arcade-perfect ports.bovine wrote:I think the dreamcast is overrated if anything.
someday those dudes will make something just a touch less artsy and more mainstream and i will be hooked like crack. sadly i turn out to be a fairly visceral gamer in the end...trying ico was like watching a beautiful painting that made me ashamed that i wished i was playing something like god of war instead. i turn out to be less of an arthouse gamer than i would have liked.Zeus wrote:Listen to the PhD student. Colossus was one of the best games of last generation and it was nothing other than finding and beating 16 BIG ASS bosses. It was incredible.Kupek wrote:One was made, and it was called Shadow of the Colossus.The Seekrshank Redemption wrote:someone should make a game where you fight only major bosses but don't need to slaughter hordes of peons throughout the game in order to stay fit enough to get through.
The controller itself was nothing revolutionary, as it was just a slightly altered version of the Saturn 3d controller. The saturn's version even had a removable cord slot so you could possibly put expansions in (though I didn't ever see anything happen with that).Zeus wrote:The controller that looked stupid is actually the inspiration for the Xbox and 360 controllers and was insanely comfortable.
Kupek wrote:One was made, and it was called Shadow of the Colossus.The Seekrshank Redemption wrote:someone should make a game where you fight only major bosses but don't need to slaughter hordes of peons throughout the game in order to stay fit enough to get through.
You're kidding me, right? Did you even play Soul Calibur, Crazy Taxi, Seaman, Ikaruga, MvC2, RE: Code Veronica, Mars Matrix, Bangai-O, or anything other than Beserk on it?SineSwiper wrote:Sword of the Berserk was probably the only good game on the Dreamcast that I could play through. Grandia 2 had a shitty story, agreed. Like Don was saying, the rest of the library was flawed.
Crazy Taxi wasn't exactly "cult", it was all over the arcades and even had a sequel on the Xbox. Neither was Marvel vs Capcom 2, it's a very popular game with fighting fans.Don wrote:Besides RE I'm willing to bet the average guy has never heard of these games and I don't know why they'd care. Aside from Soul Calibur at best you named some cult games that someone who is particularly into something special might like, but that's not how you build a system around.
A friend of mine JUST picked that game up on ebay and beat it. He loved it. I watched him play it and it looked like fun even several years later.Kupek wrote:One was made, and it was called Shadow of the Colossus.The Seekrshank Redemption wrote:someone should make a game where you fight only major bosses but don't need to slaughter hordes of peons throughout the game in order to stay fit enough to get through.
And my point is that these games aren't really that great, despite the fact most people may have never heard of them.Kupek wrote:Don, Zeus' point wasn't that the DC should have succeeded, but that despite its failure, it had some great games. Then he listed the ones he liked.
How does that have anything to do with the fact that Sine and I thought the library is flawed? Does his opinion overturn ours? It's very easy to argue most of the DC's library had some kind of problem. In fact that's about as true a statement as you can make in something that's usually very subjective. You can't deny stuff like Grandia had no story, or PSO(nline) wasn't playable online, or Skies of Arcadia had nothing outside of airships. That doesn't mean they can't be great games but having a crippling weakness tends to prevent the game from achieving any kind of mass recognition.Kupek wrote:To Zeus, they are great games.Don wrote:And my point is that these games aren't really that great, despite the fact most people may have never heard of them.
That is a matter of opinion. There are many that agree with both of usDon wrote:And my point is that these games aren't really that great, despite the fact most people may have never heard of them.Kupek wrote:Don, Zeus' point wasn't that the DC should have succeeded, but that despite its failure, it had some great games. Then he listed the ones he liked.
PSO, Grandia 2, Skies of Arcadia, Soul Calibur, MvC, Power Stone, Sonic Adventures, the new Rival Schools game (whatever it was called), and probably some others. Half of them I got bored after 30 minutes.Zeus wrote:That is a matter of opinion. There are many that agree with both of usDon wrote:And my point is that these games aren't really that great, despite the fact most people may have never heard of them.Kupek wrote:Don, Zeus' point wasn't that the DC should have succeeded, but that despite its failure, it had some great games. Then he listed the ones he liked.
Out of sheer curiosity, how many DC games did you sit and play? And what kind of games do you like?
I'm assuming that Sine, true to form, has not played most of the DC library that he's evaluating.Don wrote:How does that have anything to do with the fact that Sine and I thought the library is flawed?Kupek wrote:To Zeus, they are great games.Don wrote:And my point is that these games aren't really that great, despite the fact most people may have never heard of them.
Yes, yes, and yes. We talked about it on this board, but maybe not enough. It was one of the few super secret gems on the PS2 that was commonly overlooked. I only played through it once, but now since i forget most ways to beat the bosses, i def need to pick it up again. Great game that, at times, will beg you to look up how to beat the bosses on GameFAQs, but dont do it. Be a classic hardcore and figure it out, much more rewarding.Lox wrote:A friend of mine JUST picked that game up on ebay and beat it. He loved it. I watched him play it and it looked like fun even several years later.Kupek wrote:One was made, and it was called Shadow of the Colossus.The Seekrshank Redemption wrote:someone should make a game where you fight only major bosses but don't need to slaughter hordes of peons throughout the game in order to stay fit enough to get through.
I remember seeing this review on Phantasy Star 4 or 3 on some magazine, it showed this guy walking next to this town, with thought bubble "I need to buy some telepipes", and then a random encounter appeared. He killed those guys, next frame he accidentally walked one step the other way, got another random encounter. After that it shows a frame of him saying "I think I was supposed to go to this town for something but I can't remember now", and I think after that he walked one step the right way and got yet another random encounter.The Seekrshank Redemption wrote:I don't know. I found the towns and cities very interesting In Skies of Arcadia. I also remember dozens of characters, many of which recruited to the crew and used to populate the town you build. I also found the dungeons much more interesting than Grandia 2's for example. Although I will admit the Dreamcast version's encounter rate was too high; this was the only real flaw, fixed in Legends (along with plot holes surrounding Ramirez, the Empire, and Galcian).
The game was pirated to hell, people are surprised I actually own a real copy of the DC version.
I also don't think all cult games are necessarilly flawed, nor do I think wouldn't appeal to more given proper marketing. Chrono Trigger in North America is a great example; a 13 year old port slaughtered the original in sales.
It cracked 250k sold here in North America so it wasn't exactly "overlooked". It just didn't sell nearly as much as it deserved to while other tripe sold incredibly well.Flip wrote:Yes, yes, and yes. We talked about it on this board, but maybe not enough. It was one of the few super secret gems on the PS2 that was commonly overlooked. I only played through it once, but now since i forget most ways to beat the bosses, i def need to pick it up again. Great game that, at times, will beg you to look up how to beat the bosses on GameFAQs, but dont do it. Be a classic hardcore and figure it out, much more rewarding.Lox wrote:A friend of mine JUST picked that game up on ebay and beat it. He loved it. I watched him play it and it looked like fun even several years later.Kupek wrote: One was made, and it was called Shadow of the Colossus.
What? I had zero issues remembering anything in FF9 and never remember the game becoming a drag to play due to the insane encounter rate. To me, FF7 was FAAR worse with the encounter thing, particularly near the end when you're making your way to Sephiroth. I was just doing everything in my power to run from every fight just to end the game 'cause it dragged so much and you fought every 7 seconds. FF9 was easily the best of the PSX FF games and should have been FF7 in more ways than one.Don wrote: FF9 had the same problem where excessive encounter rate means at the end you don't actually remember what happened in the game.
I'm not sure how you remember things but it's widely acknowledged FF9 had the worst enemy encounter rate out of all the recent FFs. And some of the stuff you fight at the end are actually pretty tough too. The only hard part in the last dungeon in FF7 is if you got Master Tonberries, which have always been more like a boss than a random encounter in all the FFs.Zeus wrote:What? I had zero issues remembering anything in FF9 and never remember the game becoming a drag to play due to the insane encounter rate. To me, FF7 was FAAR worse with the encounter thing, particularly near the end when you're making your way to Sephiroth. I was just doing everything in my power to run from every fight just to end the game 'cause it dragged so much and you fought every 7 seconds. FF9 was easily the best of the PSX FF games and should have been FF7 in more ways than one.Don wrote: FF9 had the same problem where excessive encounter rate means at the end you don't actually remember what happened in the game.
Not my recollection at all. I remember FF7 and Xenogears being far worse with their random encounters. It could also be that I actually enjoyed the battles in FF9 whereas I couldn't wait to run away from the battle system in the other two games. But FF9 never once felt as though it was hindering in any way due to the random encountersDon wrote:I'm not sure how you remember things but it's widely acknowledged FF9 had the worst enemy encounter rate out of all the recent FFs. And some of the stuff you fight at the end are actually pretty tough too. The only hard part in the last dungeon in FF7 is if you got Master Tonberries, which have always been more like a boss than a random encounter in all the FFs.Zeus wrote:What? I had zero issues remembering anything in FF9 and never remember the game becoming a drag to play due to the insane encounter rate. To me, FF7 was FAAR worse with the encounter thing, particularly near the end when you're making your way to Sephiroth. I was just doing everything in my power to run from every fight just to end the game 'cause it dragged so much and you fought every 7 seconds. FF9 was easily the best of the PSX FF games and should have been FF7 in more ways than one.Don wrote: FF9 had the same problem where excessive encounter rate means at the end you don't actually remember what happened in the game.
