Speculating a sinking ship (Greece)

[kali o.]

Keeping my eye on Greece, trying to time investment (small building, residential OR waterfront property/lot). It seems, to me, a default is on it's way no matter what by August. The money simply isn't there. Even if they manage to delay the repayment, it is inevitable. The real question is...where is the bottom? It seems if Greece is likely to leave the Euro (and thus the currency change), that will be kick off for the fire sales.

Anyone else have EU citizenship? I figure at the bottom you should be able to pick up a decent 2 bdrm in Athens for 15k(Island properties like Mykonos will still be a little pricey, 100k+)...so I mean, for the price of a car, you can grab a summer home. Even if you don't have the EU citizenship, still possible to buy...

[Shrinweck]

On a humorous note from John Oliver's Bugle podcast, one of the Greek politicians upon his election promised a return to the glory of the old days.

A tall fucking order.

[kali o.]

Lol...I am not sure if they meant ancient greece days (if thats what u are implying). I forget when I was last there (2007?) but things were pretty good then. The problem is greeks are notoriously scammy and avoided taxes...it was bound to catch up to them.

[Shrinweck]

I don't want to take credit for the podcast's joke, but yeah, that's the joke they were making. I don't remember Greece ever having a reputation since I've been alive of being an especially nice place, but my grandparents visited there when my grandfather retired and they enjoyed it. It's sad that they've fallen upon selling assets to pay off their debts to the EU banks. It's sad that things have gone in the direction where the political parties are essentially having an argument about remaining with the EU and selling the country's assets or throwing caution to the wind and declaring bankruptcy/defaulting on the loans and heading towards a clean slate.

In all honesty, it's probably better for everyone involved to just cut their losses, but that's the expert opinion of someone who got a C- or something in their economics classes in college.

[Replay]

In all honesty, it's probably better for everyone involved to just cut their losses, but that's the expert opinion of someone who got a C- or something in their economics classes in college.

That explains so much to me, Shrinnie.

[Julius Seeker]

I think you're going to be disappointed. http://www.homegreekhome.com/en/search/ ... 102/m2208m

[Replay]

Haha, well played Seeker!

[kali o.]

I think you're going to be disappointed. http://www.homegreekhome.com/en/search/ ... 102/m2208m

I am not sure what you wanted to show me with that link.

- it defaulted to glyfada, which is the upper end
- sales are at about 5-10% (most of that commercial) of historical norms. Stuff isnt selling and hasnt since 2012.
- even in glyfada you find smaller apartments at 30k - and grab it as low as 20k. Thats 50% less than even a year and a half ago.
- if a euro exit is assured, the real sales start...

As for mental...LOL. It would be cool if you could post photos of where you live. I bet you have "screenshots" all over ur walls, with arrows and shit. Anyway, take ur crazy shit out of this thread.

[kali o.]

**Purges the derail**

[Replay]

What is it you're scared of, Kali?

Free speech?

Someone getting in your plans to profit from the Greeks' suffering?

You'll be a busy man if you keep having to "purge" every mention I make of your plans to buy up some poor defrauded Greek person's mortgage so you can buy his or her home for a fraction of what it's really worth.

[ManaMan]

Anyone else have EU citizenship? I figure at the bottom you should be able to pick up a decent 2 bdrm in Athens for 15k(Island properties like Mykonos will still be a little pricey, 100k+)...so I mean, for the price of a car, you can grab a summer home. Even if you don't have the EU citizenship, still possible to buy...

That'd be pretty sweet to have a Greek vacation home except you'd still have to pay a ton of money to fly there to enjoy it.

[kali o.]

That'd be pretty sweet to have a Greek vacation home except you'd still have to pay a ton of money to fly there to enjoy it.

Rent it out a few times a year - pay for your yearly utilities, taxes and your vacation. Easy.

[ManaMan]

Know any good Greek property management companies?

[kali o.]

If you are buying an apartment, best to meet your neighbours or the resident handyman - chances are one of them could be ur point of contact (you arrange stays via airbnb). Otherwise, no not yet. I will dig up contacts when I get closer to pulling the trigger on something.

[kali o.]

Just bumping to say things are proceeding as expected (likely to come to a last minute deal to delay the inevitable until Aug)...

Currently looking at a ~1acre waterfront lot on Crete. Asking 80k, but I suspect I can get ~40k soon enough. Construction work will be dirt cheap post exit.

...still, never know.

[ManaMan]

Buy low, sell high. Good investment. You'll also be jump starting the economy with the new construction!

[Replay]

Just bumping to say things are proceeding as expected (likely to come to a last minute deal to delay the inevitable until Aug)...

Currently looking at a ~1acre waterfront lot on Crete. Asking 80k, but I suspect I can get ~40k soon enough. Construction work will be dirt cheap post exit.

...still, never know.

It's really sad that this entire community seems to support what has been an effective takedown of the Greek economy by Goldman Sachs and the IMF.

Why can't you make a living without hurting other people, Kali?

" Here, in 2001, entered Goldman Sachs, which engaged in a series of apparently legal but nonetheless repellent deals designed to hide the Greek government’s true level of indebtedness. For these trades Goldman Sachs—which, in effect, handed Greece a $1 billion loan—carved out a reported $300 million in fees. The machine that enabled Greece to borrow and spend at will was analogous to the machine created to launder the credit of the American subprime borrower—and the role of the American investment banker in the machine was the same. The investment bankers also taught the Greek-government officials how to securitize future receipts from the national lottery, highway tolls, airport landing fees, and even funds granted to the country by the European Union. Any future stream of income that could be identified was sold for cash up front, and spent. "

http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2010/10/ ... nds-201010

[Replay]

Goldman's effective choice to help the old Greek government defraud its people has caused roughly one suicide per day since the crash, according to researchers.

That's what "speculating a sinking ship does", quite frankly.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/a ... nding-cuts

[kali o.]

You still have not learned to say anything sensible. It is simply good sense to buy things for the lowest possible amount, and resell at the highest possible point (within respective markets).

The reality of the scenario playing out in Greece is unchanged by any of our actions (in actuality, reinvestment and confidence is what helps an economy stabilize). Years of tax dodging is why the lazy Greeks are in deep shit, not my desire to find profit in the steaming pile after the fact.

Take your crazy conspiracy stuff to the thread I made for you. If you want to speculate on the future and the right time to buy...stick around.

[Replay]

I would as soon jump in an open Calcutta sewer as I would profit from the Greeks' suffering. That's your style - not mine.

You are well-versed at ignoring the human suffering that goes along with your "sensible" numbers"; I am here to remind you that it has a human cost.



I don't imagine the lives being lost matter to you. Knowing you, I wouldn't be surprised if the human suffering, in fact, were an inducement for you to increase your participation.

As for "crazy conspiracy stuff" - please, Michael Lewis is hardly a "conspiracy theory" author, nor is Vanity Fair a "conspiracy theory" publication. The Greeks' takedown by the international banking community has been well documented.

Yes, some of it is their fault, due to endless tax dodging.

Some of it is not; and if you actually have any real connections or power as you have claimed - you should know that. Goldman and the old government conspired to make fraudulent deals on behalf of the entire nation that would be invalidated in any honest world financial court...if any such court actually existed.

I am sure you don't care one way or another. In business terms - you are somewhere between a predator and a scavenger. I still remember what you said about loving renovictions, for instance.

Love them while you can - they'll be criminalized and stigmatized, just like redlining, one day, as the unethical practice they are.

What bothers me more is watching Mana and some of the others here selling THEMSELVES on your nonsense - and the concept that this is "good for Greece". You are offering a devil's deal here that is enticing good people in this community that I founded to buy into your brand of expedient profiteering, callous to human suffering. None of this is any more "good for Greeks" than watching Russian mobster "investors" buy up properties in New York or Israeli investors "renovate" New York's Plaza Hotel so unethically that lawsuits are piling up to this day.

http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2009/01/plaza200901

[Replay]

FYI - your "sinking ship" is now on fire too. And a big part of the anger of the anti-austerity protesters is the sale of Greek properties to foreign investors.