The Other Worlds Shrine

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  • 13 1/2 hours into Chrono Cross. Current impressions... (yeah, I know it's 2 years too late; no spoilers)

  • Because playing them is not enough, we have to bitch about them daily, too. We had a Gameplay forum, but it got replaced by GameFAQs.
Because playing them is not enough, we have to bitch about them daily, too. We had a Gameplay forum, but it got replaced by GameFAQs.
 #27336  by New and Improved Zeus
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 12:22 am
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>For those of you who have played the game, I'm currently at the Dragoon Fort inside Mount Pyre. I have 11 characters total, can't remember them all now.

Wow, really damned good so far. It started out strong and hasn't let up. One of the things that first caught my eye is not only how nice the graphics are (this is a PSX game, not a PS2, 'Box, or 'Cube game) but how they're used as well. Yes, they use pre-rendered backgrounds, but it looks like they blur them on purpose so the difference between the in-game graphics and the backgrounds is negligible. Brilliant, although sometimes irritating. Another thing is the character and personality they bring to the characters through their actions. Right in the beginning of the game, we see Serge get up and stretch before getting out of bed. We see Harle how she prances across the screen, her movements unlike any others in the game. These are little things, but it's the little things that separate the good games from the great ones.

I also like the changes to the battle system. Still haven't gotten the full impact of the field effect down (mainly because I've been given shit in the way of Elements up to this point; only a few good ones here and there), but it's a lot more interesting and strategic than the basic ATB we've seen for years. Although, the Weak, Medium, Fierce attack system is a nice change, I don't think it's much better than the standard attacks we've seen for years. After a while, the Xenogears system - which is VERY similar minus deathblows - got to be just a chore and this isn't too far behind. Really, the Weak attack is useless aside from building up the hit % for the others and the game punishes you if don't alter the pattern. It just makes it a chore to play 'cause you're constantly changing your pattern for the SOLE reason of not being punished. It does add a bit of strategy to the fighting but as Xenogears showed, it's more work than it's worth. The way the Elements are used is brilliant, though, as are the addition of a Stamina meter. It's much more of a juggling act and the battle system as a whole ends up being very good, a very nich change to the old-school systems.

One area where Chrono Cross is already among the top RPGs of all time is music. Not since Panzer Saga have I actually sat back and said "Wow, the music in basically every area in this game rules". Definetely one of the best I've ever heard. My cousin has the entire soundtrack on disc and we listen to it in his car. It sounds great even there, especially as background music to converstaion. Simply amazing.

Chrono Trigger was a brilliant game, one of the best of all time, so this game has a great deal to live up to. So far, the game has been up to the task and is shaping up to be a worthy sequel. I just hope it doesn't suffer from FF7-itis</div>

 #27337  by Eric
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 2:43 am
<div style='font: 11pt ; text-align: left; '>Elements suck, the only time you use Elements is to keep the enemy from completely covering the field in their best attack element and pummeling your party.</div>
 #27338  by Don
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 6:57 am
<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>At some point the game decides the other 40ish unimportant characters needs some spotlight too and you end up forgetting who the game is supposed to be about.

I thought Cross had some pretty challenging fights and since you can't *level up* at least not in the traditional sense, it forces you to think about it. But you can still get around it by loading up boatloads of Healing Winds or whatever the green heal all spell is (the white one is good too, but I think it's easier to get the green one).

Like Eric said, the elements suck. You're better off attacking regularly than using spells since they put you back a ton. The only reason to use elements is to knock out the enemy's advantage. The only spell that does a good punch for its price is FreeFall, the level 5 Black spell (and Black Hole I guess, but that's too rare to be useful0. But honestly the only time you can try to overpower stuff with magic is if you've a Mana Call on the field and that usually means death when the enemy casts one of their big level 6 spells, unless you've the right traps set of course...

One thing I didn't like is how insanely hard it is to get Prism equipment... and they're not even that good because it's inferior to the two top swords you get story-wise.</div>

 #27339  by New and Improved Zeus
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 1:27 pm
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Hmm, I hope not. It really has started out very, very good. I don't want this one to suffer from Square-itis as well. I'll let you know my impressions once I'm further in</div>

 #27340  by New and Improved Zeus
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 1:29 pm
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Depends. The characters' innate elemental power seem to work well. Right now, I have Luccia with the best weapon I can get her, but her pin-up doll is easily more powerful. Serge I don't even bother using elements, he's WAY too powerful.</div>

 #27343  by Blotus
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 1:47 pm
<div style='font: 10pt "arial narrow"; text-align: left; padding: 0% 5% 0% 5%; '>What is this "Square-itis" that you speak of?</div>

 #27345  by Kupek
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 3:06 pm
<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>I really missed the quick battles CT had - I loved how battles happened right there on the exploring screen.</div>

 #27348  by New and Improved Zeus
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 7:33 pm
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Starting off strong and lots of promise, but ending up disappointing in the end, mainly due to poor/shallow gameplay. FF7, Xenogears, and Bushido Blade all ended up like that</div>

 #27349  by Gentz
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 8:22 pm
<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>Yeah, I've been wondering why they can't do that with any other game it seems. Does it have to do with the 3-D engine, maybe?</div>

 #27350  by Flip
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 11:07 pm
<div style='font: 12pt "Cooper Black"; text-align: left; '>are you kidding me?? i think xenogears is the only square game to NOT suffer from this "disease". the 2nd disk was completely original, unlike any other game i've ever played. it made me get even more caught up in the amazing story line</div>

 #27351  by Eric
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 11:22 pm
<div style='font: 11pt ; text-align: left; '>While I wouldn't say the 2nd disc was bad. I would say it slowed down the pace, and kinda took some control from you.</div>

 #27352  by Kupek
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 11:39 pm
<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>That's my guess. The exploring screens are still 2D and they want to do fully 3D fights. Still, I think I'd sacrifice that for the CT style battles.</div>

 #27353  by Kupek
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 11:39 pm
<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>You say FF7, but I think we were playing a different game.</div>

 #27354  by Eric
 Wed Feb 13, 2002 11:41 pm
<div style='font: 11pt ; text-align: left; '>He's one of those weirdos that thinks FFVII was the worst in the series, well him and Seeker.</div>

 #27355  by Gentz
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 2:14 am
<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>I agree. In my opinion, RPG's reached their peak at CT as far as battle-systems go. Nothing else even compares.</div>
 #27356  by Don
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 2:42 am
<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>Serge and Glenn are another two of the good tech users though they really don't need their
techs.

The weird thing is that X Strike actually does less damage than just doing Glenn/Serge's respective level 3s... I guess you save a whole 1 point of stamina, but is it really worth it?</div>

 #27357  by Stephen
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 3:05 am
<div style='font: 10pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Psh! Grandia's is better.</div>

 #27358  by Blotus
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 8:20 am
<div style='font: 10pt "arial narrow"; text-align: left; padding: 0% 5% 0% 5%; '>I agree. It felt less like a game, and more like an interactive eh... book. I recall nodding off a few times.</div>

 #27360  by Lee
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 11:32 am
<div style='font: 10pt Arial; text-align: left; '>I agree with Stephen. Up until Grandia's system, I agree, CT did have the best battles of any RPG I'd played. But Grandia battles are just way, way more fun now.</div>

 #27361  by Torgo
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 12:13 pm
<div style='font: 9pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Too bad it was wasted on a crap storyline.</div>
 #27363  by Gentz
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 12:45 pm
<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>From what I saw, I like the system of moving around in battle, but do each of the characters have unique techniques and magic? And can you see the enemies before you fight them or does it just randomly throw you into fights while you're walking?</div>

 #27364  by Torgo
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 12:53 pm
<div style='font: 9pt Arial; text-align: left; '>I forgot to mention that Valkyrie Profile's battle system is also pretty fun.</div>

 #27365  by Torgo
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 12:58 pm
<div style='font: 9pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Enemies can be seen before you fight them, and the initiative depends on where you're facing when you engage them. And magic isn't a big part ogf this game, aside from healing.</div>

 #27366  by Kupek
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 1:02 pm
<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>Never played it.</div>

 #27368  by New and Improved Zeus
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 1:04 pm
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Not at all. I've said it a million times and I'll say it again: After Midgar, the game lost all focus, it tried to do too much, to be too dramatic. Not to mention the battles got to be boring. Although I really like the Materia system, without tweaking, it destroyed the balance of the game</div>

 #27369  by New and Improved Zeus
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 1:05 pm
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Worst of the first 4 we got, yes. I haven't played FF8, FF9, or FF10 yet, so I can't say it's the worst in the series. But it definetely worse (for it's time) than FF1, FF2, and FF3</div>

 #27370  by New and Improved Zeus
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 1:07 pm
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Hey, I never said I didn't like Xenogears, just that it proved to be disappointing. In fact, it currently stands as my fav PSX RPG. But the battle system proved to be shallow at the end, with ONLY Deathblows and Infinity Gear Attacks being useful. I agree on the 2nd disk, it saved the game IMO.</div>

 #27371  by New and Improved Zeus
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 1:10 pm
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Not at all. Xenogears has the best story of any RPG ever, IMO. By about 30 hours into the game, I was running away as much as possible just to avoid the monotony of fighting due to the shallowness of battle system. The story was the ONLY reason I kept going and the 2nd disk was all story.</div>

 #27372  by New and Improved Zeus
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 1:11 pm
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Me too....during the battles</div>

 #27373  by New and Improved Zeus
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 1:12 pm
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>We ended up taking Pierre, not Guile. During New Game + we'll grab him (we refers to my friend and I, we play RPGs through together)</div>

 #27374  by Don
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 4:21 pm
<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>Yeah, I think the battle is the strength of the Grandia games</div>

 #27375  by Stephen
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 4:32 pm
<div style='font: 10pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Yes, no.</div>

 #27376  by Stephen
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 4:34 pm
<div style='font: 10pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Magic's much bigger in Grandia II.</div>

 #27377  by Stephen
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 4:36 pm
<div style='font: 10pt Arial; text-align: left; '>So, did you cry when Chu Chu died for YOUR sins, Zeus?</div>

 #27378  by Gentz
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 5:11 pm
<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>That's really cool then. Perhaps I should look into this "Grandia" of which you speak.</div>

 #27379  by Torgo
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 6:25 pm
<div style='font: 9pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Sounds good, but how are the story and characters? I'm still reeling from the first one.</div>

 #27380  by Lee
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 6:36 pm
<div style='font: 10pt Arial; text-align: left; '>In my opinion, Grandia is what most sequels SHOULD be like. In other words, there's almost nothing about it that isn't in some way better than the original. If you played through the first you owe it to yourself to play Grandia II, I think.</div>

 #27381  by Stephen
 Thu Feb 14, 2002 10:06 pm
<div style='font: 10pt Arial; text-align: left; '>Grandia II is the only RPG I've actually finished in the past, uh, three years. Story wasn't great, but it had its moments.</div>

 #27383  by New and Improved Zeus
 Fri Feb 15, 2002 1:38 am
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>I haven't played Grandia yet, but I do have to agree that CT has the best of any RPG I've played, although FF3 and Panzer Saga's systems are very close. Xenogears ended up shallow and Chrono Cross better start making elements more a part of its system soon to catch up</div>

 #27384  by New and Improved Zeus
 Fri Feb 15, 2002 1:42 am
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Hey now, real men don't cry. But I became saddened, yes :-) Seriously, I adored the storyline. It was complex, different, and actually geared towards an semi-intelligent audience, which so few RPGs do. It actually dealt with mature issues, too</div>

 #27385  by Flip
 Fri Feb 15, 2002 8:03 am
<div style='font: 12pt "Cooper Black"; text-align: left; '>and FFX isnt? I hope you're one of the very few FFX critics out there because if not you're a hipocrit.</div>
 #27393  by Don
 Sat Feb 16, 2002 1:16 am
<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>In the beginning it's better to use the targetted versions to take out a part quickly as opposed to just use the hit all spells and try to take out 7 parts at once.

The problem is that even for a caster like Elena, White Apocalyse still does damage comparable to having all the +elemental damage stuff, and as a bonus, she doesn't sound stupid when she does White Apocalyse (actually I really like her line, "Oh Tainted Ones... Return to the World of Darkness!) as opposed to say, "Hey, stop that!" I stayed away from spells just to get around the stupid lines.</div>

 #27397  by Blotus
 Sat Feb 16, 2002 7:10 pm
<div style='font: 10pt "arial narrow"; text-align: left; padding: 0% 5% 0% 5%; '>Explain that one to me. Have you played the 2nd disc of Xenogears?</div>

 #27409  by Zeus
 Mon Feb 18, 2002 1:38 am
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Loved it. Saved the game from become overly tedious</div>

 #27413  by SineSwiper
 Mon Feb 18, 2002 1:59 am
<div style='font: 11pt "EngraversGothic BT", "Copperplate Gothic Light"; text-align: left; '>Tell me about it. Most enemies are just a Burnflame away from destruction, but then again, I'm pretty high level for my area. I like to attack the enemies, though. Lots of fun.</div>

 #27414  by SineSwiper
 Mon Feb 18, 2002 2:01 am
<div style='font: 11pt "EngraversGothic BT", "Copperplate Gothic Light"; text-align: left; '>Agreed. I don't get everybody else's hatred of the 2nd disc. I played for the excellent story, but the gameplay was good, too.</div>

 #27426  by Zeus
 Mon Feb 18, 2002 2:52 pm
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Yeah, the gameplay was good....for about 25 hours. Then the shallowness of it became a big problem</div>

 #27430  by Blotus
 Mon Feb 18, 2002 5:52 pm
<div style='font: 10pt "arial narrow"; text-align: left; padding: 0% 5% 0% 5%; '>I know you did. We all know you did, Zeus. But was I talking to you? I want Flip to answer that one.</div>

 #27437  by Zeus
 Tue Feb 19, 2002 3:37 am
<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Sorry, didn't realize this was a private chat. Sine, maybe we could add a feature to the forum where more than one person can answer a post so Flip can answer this one :-)</div>
 #27440  by Blotus
 Tue Feb 19, 2002 1:15 pm
<div style='font: 10pt "arial narrow"; text-align: left; padding: 0% 5% 0% 5%; '>...you've added your $0.02 on the second disc a million times here, I already know you loved it. You didn't need to state that again. Now, since Flip is labeling me a hypocrite for calling Xeno's second disc an interactive book, I wanted him to explain that statement to me.</div>