More news from Mr. So-Six-Months-Ago, Ninja Gaiden is truly badass! The combat system is amazingly complex, but I guess that's what you get from a team who designs fighting games.

[Zeus]

<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Talking about starting games from scratch, Super Ghouls 'N Ghosts might just be the hardest platformer (if not game) ever. It was freakin' nuts with only 5 continues and no codes....THEN you had to go through the whole thing again AND have a specific weapon to beat it (I did :-)</div>

[Zeus]

<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Oddly, Nintendo is the only company consistently putting out challenging games. Capcom, Konami, Namco, Sega all do on occasion as well, but Nintendo is consistent. The Japanese don't really want it (see original VJ sales), so we don't see it as much</div>

[Zeus]

<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Before anyone mentions it, I know Ninja Gaiden for Xbox is hard as well...</div>

[Gentz]

<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>What Nintendo games are you thinking about? Windwaker, Luigi's Mansion, and Mario Sunshine were all very easy. Was Metroid Prime tough? And a lot of Nintendo's stuff are multiplayer games where difficulty doesn't really apply as well.</div>

[Kupek]

<div style='font: 10pt verdana; text-align: left; padding: 0% 10% 0% 10%; '>Prime had a few bosses that I died a few times on, but in general, no, not a hard game.</div>

[Gentz]

<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>Yeah, that's true. The NES NG's aren't actually *that* hard if you take the time to memorize all the patterns. I don't have such patience though : )</div>

[Zeus]

<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Oh, they're hard. I just beat them like 25 times each :-)</div>

[Zeus]

<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Prime 2 was much more difficult. A good challenge, but not overly stiff</div>

[Zeus]

<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>Basically they're non-adventure games. F-Zero GP was insanely hard, too much so. Golf was fairly challenging in some of the modes (to get everything). Prime 2 provide a healthy challenge, although not insane. Some shines weren't exactly easy to get although the game was hard. Some Smash Bros.....</div>

[Zeus]

<div style='font: 9pt ; text-align: left; '>....game WASN'T hard. Some Smash Bros...</div>

[Julius Seeker]

<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>Mario Sunshine wasn't easy in comparisson to most 3D platformers, it was actually one of the more difficult ones. If you won't take my word for it, take Famitsu's.</div>

[Gentz]

<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>Those sections where you lost your water pack were tough as hell, but on the whole I thought M64 was a lot more challenging.</div>

[Gentz]

<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>Yeah, no doubt...but they *are* humanly possible to beat at least</div>

[Julius Seeker]

<div style='font: 12pt ; text-align: left; '>I'm not really sure when you played it. I assume when the game was relatively new, or at least within a few years of its release. I myself never owned it for the N64, I played it and I didn't like the game the first time I played it. The first time I played through it was after Banjo Kazooie, and I found it to be a very easy game in comparison. That was years ago, I also finished the game for DS in about two days.

I find Mario Sunshine to be much more difficult for various reasons, first of all, the levels are far more complex and require a far more diverse strategy to get past. Second of all, the enemies actually offer quite a bit of difficulty (Mario 64's enemies were all basic and only offered difficulty when they were placed in unusual locations). The only times I ever died in Mario 64 (at least this time around) were from falling.

Actually, speaking of difficulty on Mario games, try going and playing Mario World on SNES. Lets just say I was very dissapointed with myself (especially after making fun of people who also sucked =P)</div>

[Gentz]

<div style='font: 11pt arial; text-align: left; '>I think I died from falling in Mario64 a lot more often then I was killed by enemies in Sunshine. Sunshine had some tough parts, but that last series of levels in M64 with the Rainbow Road and the Clock Tower were rougher than anything I remember in Sunshine.

Of course, I got every star in Mario64, but I didn't bother collecting all the shines in Sunshine, so it might just seem like it was easier because of that.</div>

[SineSwiper]

<div style='font: 10pt "EngraversGothic BT", "Copperplate Gothic Light", "Century Gothic"; text-align: left; '>What are you talking about? Capcom loves difficulty like a S&M freak likes pain.</div>