The Other Worlds Shrine

Your place for discussion about RPGs, gaming, music, movies, anime, computers, sports, and any other stuff we care to talk about... 

  • How to make a good, cheap game

  • Because playing them is not enough, we have to bitch about them daily, too. We had a Gameplay forum, but it got replaced by GameFAQs.
Because playing them is not enough, we have to bitch about them daily, too. We had a Gameplay forum, but it got replaced by GameFAQs.
 #126614  by Don
 Sat Sep 13, 2008 6:14 am
and how to fail to have it reach people (title would be too long).

I picked up something called Touhou Project, which is a shooter on Windows made by some guy in Japan. The development team consist of one guy, who does the programming, art, music, and everything else in the game. The game looks something like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqH43tDi ... re=related (from various games). It might be hard to tell on Youtube but the actual game doesn't look any worse compared to most shooters that's not a graphics powerhouse, like say Raiden or Gradius. All the game in the series sell for around $15 (1470 yen). Since only one guy develops the team it sure can't cost too much, and I certainly don't mind paying $15 for a game like that, except for one problem.

It should be obvious from the video this game isn't remotely playable by normal human beings. Neverthelss I decided to download a demo Touhou Project 11, the latest one available, and proceeded to get totally spanked. I'm not a huge fan of shooters but I can usually beat most of them on a normal setting after enough tries, but this one I can't even get past the first stage on easy. You have unlimited continues but you always start at the starting area of one subpart which means if you're not able to beat a boss in 3 lives you won't be getting anywhere. If you continue at all you get the bad ending, and all the achivement awards requires not dying on the boss phases to get them. I think someone said this game on normal is about as hard as Ikagura on the highest settings, and there are two settings above Normal (Hard and Lunatic).

To further complicate things, you can probably tell from the video that this game is very artistic. There's a build in replay feature because you're probably not going to be able to watch the whole screen while you're dodging the stuff, and the pattern picked in the video are what people consider to be the best patterns in the games, which are only available on the Lunatic difficulty. So basically unless you're a shooter living god you won't ever get to see the best part of the game except on Youtube. The last two patterns are the last two patterns from Touhou Project 8, which is number 221 and 222. I'm guessing if I actually got that, I'd be lucky to get past pattern number 10. Apparently the game also has some very well developed characters for a shooter and they're also developed by their Hard/Lunatic levels, as the patterns have names that reveal characteristic of the person you're fighting against. So in short, you're basically missing out on everything in the game if you can't play at the high difficulty levels.

On one hand, I'm quite impressed one guy can create a game that is easily worthy of buying in today's environment, and on the other hand, it's a shame that a game is totally out of reach for average joe like you or me simply because the difficulty is borderline on impossible. The weird thing is that the game obviously have enough bragging rights built into it. If you look at a video of an *average* player who can beat the game without dying, and then compare it to the Japanese guy who goes by the handle of "Emperor of Heavens", you'll realize that the Japanese guy has a score 10 times higher than an average person who can beat the game without dying. This kind of reminds me of an article I read on the Ninja Gaiden remakes about how you shouldn't make a game where the average guy can't possibly beat. I'm quite willing to take 999 lives and whatever title of suckage to do the last 2 patterns shown in the video, but that option isn't even offered, and as much as I like this game, I'm not going to buy something I can't get past the first stage!

 #126617  by SineSwiper
 Sat Sep 13, 2008 9:04 am
Sure, the average player can beat Ninja Gaiden, but he'll have to stick to the easy difficulty. It's good to have a game for the rest of us, considering most games are too damn easy anyway. (Capcom excluded.)

But, I agree with you on shooters. Most of those are too damn hard. And the people who end up on the top 360 lists are just people with WAAAAY too much time on their hands. Take E4, which is a neat game, but you realize quickly that the best way to get a high score is to play it for 4-6 hours (or longer). The top scorers probably just played the game for 12 hours, paused the game, went to sleep, and played for another 12 hours. Who the hell wants to do that? It's no longer fun after that, and trust me, you play the same song for 4-6 hours, and you really get sick of it.

 #126622  by Don
 Sat Sep 13, 2008 11:28 am
Certainly a game can have a very tough hardcore mode, but you should be able to enjoy a game in its entirety no matter how much you suck. A scoring system should be enough to validate for the hardcore of just how tough things are. When I beat Sonic the Hedgehog the first time and found out you get bad ending for not enough Chaos Emeralds my first thought isn't to find them all, it was more like 'this is what I get for beating the game?' I can assure you that there's no need to worry about me being mistaken for the guy playing in the video just because they allow people like me to beat the game on its hardest setting.

Gradius 5 would be considered very easy compared to this game, and even then I bet most people need to play it for about 15 hours to unlock the unlimited credits mode to actually have a chance at beating the game. Even the video says (in Japanese): "These videos feature a very difficult game. Do not try this at home". As if you can't tell the guy playing is some kind of living god!