The Shrine

kali o. wrote:Actually, we should start a thread on the failure of mental health support in western culture. I think it's symptomatic of a larger change in culture and perception -- it's not compassionate to leave addicts and the mentally ill on the street; it's the height of cruelty, made that much more sickening by the fact people pat themselves on the back for leaving people in a personal hell without support. Institutionalization is sometimes the actual compassionate choice - the electroshock prisons of old do not have to be the standard.

Discuss.

If I wanted to start a thread on the topic; I would have.

Instead of this low effort thread, maybe you can share your personal experiences and stories (therapy, family, medication, day to day functioning, etc). You do have mental illnesses and have suffered for at least a decade - that makes you an expert, in some respects.. That could be an interesting starting point.

Because sharing my personal experiences in your presence has been treated with such good faith and integrity on your part in the past?

Well, you already believe I know all about you...

But in any case, post something interesting - not just a cut and paste of my already shared ideas. If you prefer, I can just delete this thread.

If it's going to be a referendum on the mental health of any given member of the Shrine, as opposed to a public policy discussion - then yes, please do delete it. There's no point or purpose - especially as you have admitted to going to prostitutes and have made a death threat against me here, actions that will arguably render your opinion on anyone's mental health inadmissible in any serious discussion - or court of law, for that matter - as your own record at the Shrine is probably cause for a diagnosis itself.

Don't start with me this morning, Killer. I can and will see your threat against me entered into various public records and will see your own mental fitness challenged publicly, if you choose to make this about personality instead of principles.

That all being said - I will say at least one thing:

Why is our mental health system so broken?

Because there are profoundly evil and unwell people running the system, as there are running many systems of power in the modern world.

Our prescription drug companies have continually and remorselessly promoted profit-taking and the sale of new drugs, hiding evidence of incredibly destructive side effects when drugs are found unsuitable in order to sell them anyway and avoid losses. Our hospitals and medical systems routinely bankrupt families over relatively simple emergency room visits, causing mental stress and hardship for years afterwards that produce new cases of mental hardship - look up the diathesis-stress model of mental illness.

Yet the CEO's of these organizations are not prosecuted for mental illness or criminality themselves, just about ever - the United States is in the midst of a serious opioid crisis that has produced hundreds of thousands of overdose deaths, and yet a total of *one* major executive has been successfully prosecuted in the last several years.

Is it a wonder that so many people are thus suffering hardship?

Why is there a mental health crisis in America? Well, at least partially - it is because Americans are being driven to the brink of madness by inequality, corruption, greed, and hatred - by incredibly mentally ill people among the class of our leaders who will never be diagnosed with any mental illness, because they know how to work the system to protect themselves from such.

Donald Trump promoted sexual assault with his "grab them by the pussy" remarks; Bill Clinton had an affair in the Oval Office and then committed perjury to hide it - yet those men have never faced clinical diagnosis for their own sins and mental health failures. The system punishes those who seek help, prescribing dangerous drugs and taking away their rights for a lifetime. It rewards instead those who will never seek help - Nixon may be the ultimate example of this; a man who would do anything for power but to see a psychiatrist, or admit that he was unwell.

How many people do you think may have suffered mental hardship, or worse, upon eviction from their apartments or homes during your hostile takeovers?

"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society." --Krishnamurti

Your theories / assertions don't appear to hold up under scrutiny. Simply blaming CEOs and mysterious powerful rich people might be your favorite catchall, but as there is profit in treating mental illness (and the prevailing current criticism is non-treatment of mental illness), your explanation doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Massive government and private investment into psychotherapy and institutionalization / housing is worth billions, if not trillions, so the idea that "rich people" are preventing proper investment is utter nonsense.

Further, the opioid epidemic is a worldwide phenomenon, not a Western or even North American issue. So your critique there doesn't hold up either -- unless you are simply viewing things from your own local tunnel vision.

Opioids are interesting. They are highly addictive but they are also extraordinarily effective. Every patient and doctor knows they are addictive at this point, so I fail to see any justification you have for wanting these companies/creators "in prison"...for what? Creating an effective drug that other parties are misusing?

Back on topic -- no, I think the current failure in treating mental illness is a result of 4 main factors: a history of maltreatment over the last century, a social stigma of being mentally ill, the ability to ignore mental illness as it is not usually, itself, fatal (suicide and high risk behavior are corelated, not symptomatic) and a cultural shift away from personal / social responsibility in favor of individual and group "human rights" (ask not what you can do for your country; ask what your country can do for you ).

Interestingly, that second item is a little more nuanced. For a growing number of people, illness, including mental illness, is becoming a laudable or abused trait. I think the most obvious example was the issue of ADHD and over prescription of mood stabilizers for children. Being sad sometimes or anxious or even compulsive / OCD is NOT a condition that needs treatment. Some like you, Replay, are someone who deserves and needs effective lifelong treatment. There are points were things stop becoming temporary individual quirks and develop into something that is maladaptive and devastating to ones ability to function. For example, being anxious with public speaking is NOT the same as having that anxiety develop until you are fearful to leave your home. This is further evidenced in your odd Clinton / Trump example: high functioning successful people are less likely to be diagnosed with mental illness (maybe they could do with private therapy but that's different) -- the important criteria to diagnosing actual mental illness is the negative impact and impairment to functioning in life. I think that distinction needs to be made / reinforced, both culturally and within the medical profession.

I think the biggest change will come when western society understands that institutionalism can be a good thing and the most compassionate choice for a select few in society. The stigma of electroshock and straight jackets is holding evolving treatment back.

Actually, I'm going to calm down here and apologize - my response, in its lashing out, was very disproportionate to the original message. And I say this with your own last message sight-unseen at present.

That being said - there is a reason that it happened. And that is because you - more than any other person I have ever met in this life, online or off it - are the one who has conditioned me to respond to discussions about mental health with anger and fear instead of openness and acceptance. Twelve years or more of mockery, name-calling, and repeated labeling of me as "crazy" meant for all around to see, will do that. Go ask some psychologists their expert opinion on that kind of thing, and how well it works in the treatment of mental health.

If you're serious about walking the talk you're talking about doing a better job on mental illness - then start walking it, and start changing some of those behaviors.

If you're not, then every other discussion you want to have on the subject is more or less irrelevant - and essentially akin to giving a lecture about fire safety while shooting off fireworks in a field of dry grass.

Err...I didnt read whatever rant you went on pre-edit and I didnt edit or delete any post of mine -- if you think you read something else I wrote; its in your addled mind only.

You make every thread personal, mental, and not just with me. Thats why you always feel attacked. Rather than argue a single thing I said, you went off on two (apparently) nutty rants.

And you are fucking batshit crazy. Its apparent to anyone interacting with you. Im a little surprised that word/fact bothers you, given how long youve been dealing with it.

Later man

kali o. wrote: ↑

Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:10 am

And you are fucking batshit crazy. Its apparent to anyone interacting with you. Im a little surprised that word/fact bothers you, given how long youve been dealing with it.

Oh yes, it's clear that you totally care about fixing mental health, and are 100% competent to do so. /s

You're an asshole "billionaire" who proudly boasts of stealing movies and music and software because you can't stand the idea that honest creators should get paid for their work.

You said that a Presidential candidate deserved to win because "America needs to hate again".

You took a sex junket to Thailand and "avoided the cock". You proudly boast of paying for hookers because normal women can't seem to bear touching you without a hundred-dollar bill first.

You once made a death threat against me, and with enough facility that I'd imagine it's not your first - possibly not your first murder, either.

And, of course, most of the times you call me "crazy" have to do with political disagreements - and generally because I want to show kindness and bravery where you want to show hate and intolerance. I don't think we should shoot illegal immigrants at the border or house refugees in cells that would shame a prisoner of war, therefore I must be CEO of the nut butter factory, right?

Lecture us all on mental health for days, please. I'm going back to my original position - you are a criminal and an evil person, and your opinion on mental health in America is certainly ethically and arguably legally invalid. And I can find expert witnesses for days to attest to that - psychopathy of the kind you display here is not hard to assess in court.

Don't force us all to take it to that point one day, either. I want a talk with Sine. He's handed my technology to a crook and a coward.

Why not just go ahead and murder me after all? You've always had the power to do it; most eight-or-nine-figure crooked realtors can hire a hitman. You won't be able to do it without triggering the deadman's-trigger I cooked up the last time I started getting threats and abuse from unfuckable white-collar crooks who can't get laid without someone else getting paid, and live in fear and hate and spin a web of lies to keep others from seeing their murderous natures - I've already had conversations with family, friends, and several local police about your actions here over the years - and my family and the FDIC would see you crucified against the death penalty on an electric chair.

But it might be a fun weekend, right?

Anything but this, Killer.

Anything but an eternity of watching you lie to the boards, preen around, and pretend to *yourself* that you are mentally fine and happy while you continue to spread corruption and hate in a place I worked hard to bring into the world.

Take heart though - I, myself, feel much better these days!

I'm considering possibly applying to the FDIC one day myself to gain a bit more purpose in my life, in fact. Don't you think that would be a fine way for me to find some redemption? Wouldn't you like to see an old friend put in a position of power investigating financial crime in America one day?

Replay wrote: ↑

Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:19 am

Why not just go ahead and murder me after all?

Ok.

kali o. wrote: ↑

Sat Jun 29, 2019 12:55 pm

Replay wrote: ↑

Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:19 am

Why not just go ahead and murder me after all?

Ok.

Thanks. Who do I send this latest screenshot to first?

The FDIC? The FBI? Your "handlers"? My friends in the local police?

(It's already on the cloud.)

Replay wrote: ↑

Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:44 pm

kali o. wrote: ↑

Sat Jun 29, 2019 12:55 pm

Replay wrote: ↑

Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:19 am

Why not just go ahead and murder me after all?

Ok.

Thanks. Who do I send this latest screenshot to first?

The FDIC? The FBI? Your "handlers"? My friends in the local police?

Why not all of them at once? Better hurry though, clock is ticking....tick....tock

It's an option.

"Tend to believe people when they tell you who they really are." --modern proverb

Replay wrote: ↑

Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:49 pm

It's an option.

"Tend to believe people when they tell you who they really are." --modern proverb

It looks like this is the climax of our story, Mr. Hall. The final chapter for our would-be hero - but was the hero you or I?

It wont be glorious, like you always imagined, but mundane and meaningless. A simple glitch in a common appliance perhaps, a distracted driver, a malfunctioning elevator, a carelessly discarded cigarette.

And then I will drift into the ether. tOWS will disappear, scrubbed from all records. Your computer will run a wipe sequence from the software I had installed. Even the "cloud" will cleanse itself. Your few friends, or better termed acquaintances, will forget you as they were under my employ all along.

It will be as if we both have never been. And perhaps the world is better off that way.

The End.

Lol me.rite gud

The final chapter for our would-be hero - but was the hero you or I?

This will be rich. Tell us all about how you are the hero.