Anybody remember that little gem for the PSX called Warhawk?

[Eric]

<div style='font: 11pt Modern; text-align: left; '>Anybody remember that little gem for the PSX called Warhawk?</div>

[silver_moon]

<div style='font: 12pt Modern; text-align: left; '>Borrowed it from my firend. I suck at that kind of game so I cheated all the way through to the end. Dunno what's going on though, the FMVs and sounds were skipping like hell on my PS.</div>

[Agent 57]

<div style='font: 9pt Modern; text-align: left; '>One of the finest moments in the early days of the PSX...my only problem with the game was that I managed to get all the way to the final stage, only to get my ass blasted every freaking time. So, I eventually just gave up and lowered the difficulty setting and then beat it that way. :)

You had to love Warhawk, though - it really had all the things that truly categorized what video games were trying to do with the CD format in the early days. Really hideous live-action cinemas, polygonal graphics, slightly open-ended areas - and those missle trails that were prevalent in just about every SingleTrac game back then.

Speaking of SingleTrac, you really have to give them credit for making up a large part of the console's early success. Sure, Ridge Racer and Tekken probably sold a lot of PSX's, but what kept people coming back was games like Warhawk, Twisted Metal, and Jet Moto. I really liked Jet Moto. At one point I was just about a master at that game, which made it that much more disappointing when they took all the technical skills you needed to master it - proper use of turbos, getting used to using a light or heavy bike, and getting to find a real line through the courses - and tossed it all out the farking window when they released Jet Moto 2, arguably one of the biggest disappointments of my entire gaming life.

I mean, sure, JM2 did look better, and a few of the courses were absolutely amazing - the 'heaven & hell' course in particular. But then conversely, some of them were utter crap (the Shaft,) the bikes did not control the same way at all (they evidently forgot what 'traction' was,) and unless you were using a heavy bike, you didn't have the acceleration or top speed to keep up with the pack. It was a complete insult to the incredible control the first JM had, and then after that when I played JM3 for about two minutes in Babbage's one day - which looked worse than 2, and played just as bad - I gave up on the whole series. Depressing, really.

Well...that certainly was an unprovoked rant, wasn't it? Heh...heh...heh...sorry. Gotta go now. :)</div>

[G-man Joe]

<div style='font: 11pt "comic sans MS", Modern; text-align: left; '>If PSX and Saturn were boxers, Warhawk was one of the three punch combo in the first round(Battle Arena Toshinden and Wipeout were the other two).</div>

[Agent 57]

<div style='font: 9pt Modern; text-align: left; '>I never got into VF2 very much, but I'm pretty sure that was a better game than Toshinden, which I also only played once or twice. Daytona vs. Wipeout...hm. I always liked playing Daytona in the arcades, but never got a home version (I may change that next Tuesday, though,) but I really, really liked Wipeout XL, which I'm sure played a lot like Wipeout did. And I think I would have to say that I liked Panzer Dragoon more than Warhawk. PD was just a really beautiful game, and it was a lot easier to aim in it. :D

I dunno. I mean, we all know who won out in the end, but that was because SoA was a bunch of morons who felt like denying their customers most of the good games for the system - I think that if the Saturn had worked to its strengths (2D) a little bit more, gotten a bit more publicity, and hadn't been rushed out the door (which screwed up the launch and pissed off developers,) it coulda had a chance. *shrug*</div>

[G-man Joe]

<div style='font: 11pt "comic sans MS", Modern; text-align: left; '>VF2 was not a launch title, Panzer didn't come out until way after Warhawk was old and Daytona just didn't have the gameplay like Wipeout did. I said, first round (ie beginning).</div>

[Agent 57]

<div style='font: 9pt Modern; text-align: left; '>Oops. I thought all of those games were earlier in the Saturn's life. Oh well - live and learn.</div>

[G-man Joe]

<div style='font: 11pt "comic sans MS", Modern; text-align: left; '>That's okay. You didn't get the PSX until FF7 was out so you didn't know when BAT, Wipeout and Warhawk came out.</div>

[Brack Rotus]

<div style='font: 10pt papyrus, Modern; text-align: left; padding: 0% 7% 0% 7%; '>Gotta love 989 for ruining both the Jet Moto and Twisted Metal franchises.</div>

[Stephen_S]

<div style='font: 9pt Arial, Modern; text-align: left; '>Panzer was a Saturn launch title, G-Man. It came out months before Warhawk.</div>

[G-man Joe]

<div style='font: 11pt "comic sans MS", Modern; text-align: left; '>You sure? I was thinking of Panzer Dragoon Saga. Ah well.....Warhawk came out a month after the PSX luanch(I know it was before PSX's first Christmas here)</div>

[Agent 57]

<div style='font: 9pt Modern; text-align: left; '>See? See??? I told you so, I told you so!!!! :P</div>

[G-man Joe]

<div style='font: 11pt "comic sans MS", Modern; text-align: left; '>I think I'm right about Warhawk. I quite sure it came out before Panzer.</div>

[Don]

<div style='font: 12pt Modern; text-align: left; '>The American market is very dominated by 3D gaming so the Saturn's advantage in 2D means very little.

Publicity thing is doubtful... advertising is expensive, and the effect is not always positive. Consider the position Sega is in, there's no way Nintendo or Sony would ever let them have a chance to do some serious advertising blitz anyway. Sure, Sega can advertise, but then Nintendo and Sony would just advertise more. It'd end up hurting everyone, but Nintendo and Sony can certainly afford to eat up more losses than Sega can. Yeah maybe if Sega dug up a billion dollar and advertised they could've taken some grounds, if Nintendo and Sony are somehow stupid and didn't notice the number of Sega ads went up by 300% or whatever that is needed to make a difference. No, it doesn't work that way. If Sega advertises, then Sony & Nintendo will advertise MORE and you're back to exactly where you started with. Actually, you end up in a worse position, since you're back to where you started, but with wasted money on advertising.

I think Toshinden certainly looks better than Virtua Fighter 2, not on a how many polygons-are-there level, but just on an aesthetic level. Most people don't really care about gameplay (e.g. the success of the VS series which is fundamentally broken, engine-wise). I think game developers forget that it's not how cool these joints look like because there's 5 billion polygons are there. No, when most people say 'This game has awesome graphics' they mean just that, something that looks awesome. No one cares if VF2 uses more polygons if it doesn't really look better.

As for Panzer Dragoon, it was just one of those titles that no one's ever heard of, and the few that play it says it's really good. That may be true, but that doesn't affect the industry in a meaningful way.</div>

[M'k'n'zy]

<div style='font: 9pt "Copperplate Gothic Light", Modern; text-align: left; '>GOd yes, I love that game. I still break it out and play it every now and again. That indoor level was a bitch!</div>

[Stephen_S]

<div style='font: 9pt Arial, Modern; text-align: left; '>PDS came out at the very end of the Saturn's life cycle. I think Agent 57 was referring to the original shooter.</div>

[Stephen_S]

<div style='font: 9pt Arial, Modern; text-align: left; '>Why are you comparing PDS to Warhawk? They're two completely different genres.</div>

[G-man Joe]

<div style='font: 11pt "comic sans MS", Modern; text-align: left; '>I'm not.</div>